Thanks for taking the time to put in your 2 cents.

As someone who used to moderate at M-Audio's Torq DJ user forum for
the first year of it's existence, I assure you you can go online and
say things like "M-Audio sucks" without fear. You can say far far
worse, and hundreds of people have without repercussion, just do a
search (or not, forum searches do suck for certain tasks). The main
forums are new, but the Torq forum has something like 2 years under
it's belt. And the Pro Tools forum is downright ancient, you can go
on there and say whatever you want there as well. Companies learned
that you can't go on and piss on users for badmouthing them a long
time ago, anyone with half a brain knows that's a terrible way to run
a forum, and that's not how things are run over there. I wouldn't
have moved this group over there if I didn't have an intimate
understanding of how forums are run at M-Audio, and was satisfied with
how such things like that are handled.

As much time as I've spent here, I spent far more at the Torq forum -
- and it's my firm opinion that the forum format is a better format
for creating an active community that people want to participate in
regularly. I don't think this yahoogroups community every really got
off the ground in that regard - - other than our awesome user studio
pics folder, the primary focus was always "Help! can I have some
alternative tech support?". ;)

I'm so glad there are people being paid to answer those types of
questions at the new site.. . they're doing a killer job so far, and
without my snarky attitude. ;)

Sell your user data? I think you're giving them too much credit, but
don't you think that's what's happening with your yahoo account? And
what data are you required to give in a vBulletin reg form that is so
critical and otherwise secret? SPAM? No way. This was not my
experience with the Torq forum.

The fact that you can organize and search your personal email archives
is commendable, but the overwhelming majority of people who sign up
here have proven that they can't do this. . . there is a whole lot of
hate mail here regarding the yahoogroups format, and 2 emails
(including yours) about the virtues of old fashioned email groups.
(That being said, I am still eternally grateful to Yahoo for keeping
this eGroups acquisition alive and running all these years - - My
earliest online community experiences were all with
egroups/yahoogroups - I'm sorry I wasn't able to try out this group
with the upcoming "new" yahoogroups beta)

As far as the dynamics of this group goes, it was usually just a place
where theworldneedsrock and myself answered people's questions. There
were a few others that helped from time to time, and I greatly
appreciate their contributions (thanks guys!), but the days of rock
and I answering questions all day long for this community have come to
an end, I need a break from it, and I'm sure rock does too. I'm happy
with what I've been able to contribute the past 2 years, and it's time
for me to move on to other online communities/efforts/projects. I get
too bitter, burnt-out, and grumpy if I continue too long and let the
grind get to me - - I've moderated/managed communities long enough to
know that about myself. . . I start making posts that where I
embarrass myself, snap at new users for asking the same old questions,
etc. I'd rather move this group to a place where everyone can get
what they want (tips and tech support), than to just abandon this
group for months and let it start to suck. For the yahoogroups
bot-SPAM issue alone, I'm grateful for the move. I realize that
theworldneedsrock was a much stronger contributor than I was on most
occasions, he became the primary content guy. . . I won't speak for
him, but I know he is crazy busy with new pursuits as well, and
supports the move.

So yes, points noted. Glad to hear that some people actually liked
this yahoogroups format better. The web archives here will remain
searchable forever, so hopefully the work done here can still help
people in the days ahead.

Thanks for letting me know your thoughts!

-cF



--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "Poul Wehner" <poul.wehner@...>
wrote:
>
> Since you asked...
> I don't like forums,
> And _any_ email client is superior to any forum software when it comes
> to searching, filing, etc. on top of that email is faster.
> And I hate having Yet Another Password.
> And it's naive to think that any forum run by a commercial entity will
> not sell some form of user data to a third party or even directly spam
> the user base (and no I don't take any companies policy speak as truth
> or a promise).
> A independant mail list is independant. If I want to post "M-Audio
> sucks ass here's why" I can. If I do that on their own forum I'll
> likely be censored or perhaps banned.
> I haven't contributed to this group because I'm a total newbie and I
> don't have a lot of time to spare on my hobby so I lurk and glom what
> I can.
> I have not joined the forum. I probably will at some point but I know
> that when I do it's just going to be perfunctory action taken to solve
> any particular problem I may have w/ the keyboard or application.
> I appreciate very much the work (and time) you and others have
> contributed to this group. I understand the reasons you decided to
> make this change.
> Because I'm a lurker my opinion doesn't matter as much as yours or the
> heavy contributers but you asked-:)
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 6:54 PM, controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>
wrote:
> > Hi guys,
> >
> > A user just emailed me privately and said he couldn't find the xml
> > files at the new location (they're under "Links/Downlaods") and that
> > the new location overall was "useless".
> >
> > Do you guys agree?
> >
> > Those of you who actually used this yahoo group for awhile. . . do you
> > really feel that the new location is inferior to this one?
> >
> > I've already listed my reasons for why a full-supported vbulletin
> > implementation with paid tech support reps answering questions is a
> > big improvement over the limits placed on us by this yahoogroup.
> > Theworldneedsrock always answered the overwhelming majority of the
> > questions, which were usually just tech support questions anyway, and
> > I reached the breaking point in terms of repeatedly directing new
> > customers to the tutorial files we'd assembled and repeatedly
> > explaining to newcomers how this dated yahoogroups format works.
> >
> > In fact, when this group first launched, all anyone did was complain
> > about the yahoogroups format and how they wished it was vBulletin or
> > similar. . . . I guess you can please some of the people some of the
> > time I guess. . . . ;)
> >
> > Anyway, what are your thoughts? Do you guys feel anything is missing
> > from the new M-Audio location?
> >
> > -cF
> >
> >
>