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#33 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:41 pm
Subject: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
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>
> Now I see the hassles of PT and midi, maybe they thought hexadecimal
> would be the next big craze, or had lazy programmers?  :)

nah, hex is just the unfriendly old-timey way of doing things.

PT has historically been lacking in MIDI support, as they entered the
game as an professional audio-multitracker, whereas others like Cubase
and Logic began life as MIDI-only sequencers on the Atari ST and
incorporated audio once PT had proven it was feasable and average
consumer hardware was up to the task.

-cF

#32 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:13 pm
Subject: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
controlphr33k
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This was emailed to me by RockStarJared, who had a response to this PT question:

I was able to setup my Oxygen 8 as a control surface in Pro Tools.
You need to download a Control Surface file from Digidesign for the
CS-10.

1. Go to http://archive.digidesign.com/download/controllers and
download the Legacy MIDI Controller file (CS-10).
2. Install this file in Applications > Digidesign > Pro Tools>
Controllers (Mac)
C:\Program Files\Common Files\Digidesign\DAE\Controllers (PC)
3. Open PTMP Peripherals from Set Up drop down menu
4. Choose third tab "MIDI controllers" and select CS-10 under type,
then Oxy 8 V2 (or whatever controller you're using) for
both "Receive from" and "Send to" as well as "8" for "# Ch's"
5. Open Enigma and map controllers as follows:

Global channel: 16
Volume knobs/sliders: cc 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71
Rewind: cc 19
FF: cc 20
Stop: cc 21
Play: cc 22
Record: cc 23


Pan (for selected track): 77
Send 1-5 (for selected track): 75,76,72,73,74
Shift: cc 9
Option: cc 14
Control: cc 15
Command: cc 16

This should work for any M-Audio keyboard.

Please note that to automate XPand!, you must disable the CS-10
option from Peripherals.

Rock on!


--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@...>
wrote:
>
> I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in
protools. I
> found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the ksp
and
> the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to
refer
> to the midi guide for this sort or stuff. Where is this guide?
OR is
> there a learn function in protools? It's a shame having those 27
nobs
> and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools. :)
>
> I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
> Thanks.
>
> Any other Protools users here?
>

#31 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 9:29 pm
Subject: Re: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "thabias" <thabias@...> wrote:
>
> Sorry for the confusion guys. Maybe I can try to make this more clear.
> I would like to be able to assign multiple midi keys to the same note
> so they trigger the same drum. Suppose I wanted C2-C3 to all be bass
> drums. I'd have to assign 36 to each key. In a sense that's what I'm
> driving at - to be able to assign 36-45 to one or more white/black
> keys (map the same note more than once for bass drum and snare).
> Picture looking at the keys and from the left having notes assigned as
> such: 36,36,37,37,38,39,40,41,42,43,44,45.
>
> I tried the overrides, but they don't allow more than one midi key for
> each override. So, I had to use the default midi keys assigned to
> 36-45 in conjunction with Reason's overrides so I could get 2
> kicks/snares/HHs.
>
> If you load up Reason's Redrum and turn on the axiom, by default
> you'll see you have to drop one octave so that you get into the
> correct range to play notes 36-45.

Thank you for taking the time to clarify scott, much appreciated!

Well, getting the Reason and any MIDI controller to do what you outlined
doesn't s seem likely, unless you can create three separate key zones on
the Axiom and somehow get Reason to trigger drums based on data linked
to the ch-aftertouch for that zone. . . . . but I don't think that's
likely.

Well, personally, if I couldn't live with just using 2 fingers on a drum
pad to do fast rolls and double kicks. . which is one of the reasons
those pads are there in the first place. . . I would just creat a
separate instance of Redrum for each sound and put the same sound into
each slot on Redrum.  . . depending on how well Reason manages memory
resources, it may not waste any tangile CPU or increase the memory
footprint.

If you're using Reason in a rewire setup within  a host controller, and
you own something like Reaktor or Max/MSP, you could easily create a
midi pluggin to convert any incoming midi note to any other incoming
midi note you wanted.

As far as CHH OHH cancellation in Reason. . . I'm not sure. . .that
would be one for the Reason manual, I suspect. . .I don't use Reason all
that often. . .but I'm sure someone here knows the answer.

let us know if you come up with any cool solutions to this problem.

cheers,

cF












>
> You sort of read my mind on the CHH cutting off the OHH as that was my
> next question. The VD kit has the HH pedal and I think somehow I have
> to incorporate that into Reason so when pressed it activates the CHH
> track and when released it sends the other note. You're right though,
> I have to configure Reason to cut off the OHH when playing the CHH
> track. -- Any idea on how to do that? :) If not I'll go reading, but
> if you know of the procedure for that, I'm all ears. It's something
> I'll have to do anyway when I hook the kit up to it.
>
> Thanks again for your help guys...
> -scott-
>

#30 From: "thabias" <thabias@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:46 pm
Subject: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
thabias
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Sorry for the confusion guys. Maybe I can try to make this more clear.
  I would like to be able to assign multiple midi keys to the same note
so  they trigger the same drum.  Suppose I wanted C2-C3 to all be bass
drums. I'd have to assign 36 to each key.  In a sense that's what I'm
driving at - to be able to assign 36-45 to one or more white/black
keys (map the same note more than once for bass drum and snare).
Picture looking at the keys and from the left having notes assigned as
such: 36,36,37,37,38,39,40,41,42,43,44,45.

I tried the overrides, but they don't allow more than one midi key for
each override.  So, I had to use the default midi keys assigned to
36-45 in conjunction with Reason's overrides so I could get 2
kicks/snares/HHs.

If you load up Reason's Redrum and turn on the axiom, by default
you'll see you have to drop one octave so that you get into the
correct range to play notes 36-45.

You sort of read my mind on the CHH cutting off the OHH as that was my
next question.  The VD kit has the HH pedal and I think somehow I have
to incorporate that into Reason so when pressed it activates the CHH
track and when released it sends the other note.  You're right though,
  I have to configure Reason to cut off the OHH when playing the CHH
track. -- Any idea on how to do that? :) If not I'll go reading, but
if you know of the procedure for that, I'm all ears.  It's something
I'll have to do anyway when I hook the kit up to it.

Thanks again for your help guys...
-scott-

#29 From: "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:18 pm
Subject: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
kaleuphornia
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "controlphr33k"
<controlphr33k@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@>
> wrote:
> >
> > I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in
protools. I
> > found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the
ksp and
> > the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to
refer
> > to the midi guide for this sort or stuff. Where is this guide? OR
is
> > there a learn function in protools? It's a shame having those 27
nobs
> > and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools. :)
> >
> > I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Any other Protools users here?
>
> What version of protools are you using? HD 7, M-Powered 7, LE 7?
>
> Here is some info from 2004, but I'm not sure if it's still
relevant:
>
> http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may04/articles/protoolsnotes.htm
> <http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may04/articles/protoolsnotes.htm>
>
> I'm still investigating. . . but anyone else who has some info
should
> please chime in.
>
> -cF
>
>
>


Actually, I just found what I was looking for on digidesign's website.

Here:
http://akmedia.digidesign.com/support/docs/MIDI_Cntrl_Surfaces_Guide_2
5939.pdf

Now I see the hassles of PT and midi, maybe they thought hexadecimal
would be the next big craze, or had lazy programmers?  :)

#28 From: "shanehendr" <shane@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:15 pm
Subject: Re: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
shanehendr
Offline Offline
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--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "thabias" <thabias@...> wrote:

> Ok I tried that but it's not exactly what I wanted to do.  I have to
> sort of assign the kick to override the snare D#2 in order that the
> origianl kick which is C#2 is next to it.  It's definitely better, but
> again, I thought I'd be able to assign notes to any key. Just like
> Reason has the overrides, I thought you could override anything on the
> keyboard.  I'll keep searching. Then again, my roland vdrum kit will
> do fine once it's here :)  Thanks!
> -scott-
>

You lost me on that one too.

If you're using the Axiom, why not just use the pads to get your double bass? 
I'm
assuming you want a C and D assigned to the same sample so that you can easily
(physically) play them to achieve a double bass drum effect.  Is that it?  The
pads seem like
they'd be the way to go (you can just use one pad and 2 fingers).

I don't know if you're doing this for live performance, but if you're recording
you might be
better served to record a straight beat and then go back in the sequencer and
edit in your
double bass.  I always go back and put my flourishes in via this manner (fills,
etc.).

Shane

#27 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:01 pm
Subject: Re: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
>
>
> Ok I tried that but it's not exactly what I wanted to do. I have to
> sort of assign the kick to override the snare D#2 in order that the
> origianl kick which is C#2 is next to it. It's definitely better, but
> again, I thought I'd be able to assign notes to any key. Just like
> Reason has the overrides, I thought you could override anything on the
> keyboard. I'll keep searching. Then again, my roland vdrum kit will
> do fine once it's here :) Thanks!
> -scott-

No prob.

I'm not quite sure what you're talking about re: having to "sort of
assign the kick to override the snare". sorry. As far as drum-related
overrides (like a closed hat cutting off an open hat). . you have to
set that up on the software side, because that involves killing the
decay of the sound. . . a parameter that is controlled by your
sampler/synth engine (traditionally), not your midi controller.
Devices that playback individual drum hits traditionally just use the
gate on message as a trigger, and ignore the gate off. . so the
trigger message (gate on) has no measurable duration. . how long that
drum
sound sounds out for is controlled by Reason.  If you had a sound
assinged to respond to the gate on AND off message sent by a keyboard
key (so that the sound cut off as soon as you released the key). .
that would be a bit different. . but again, there isn't a way to make
one
midi note cut off another midi note. . .you would traditionally just
have the software interpret that standard midi data the way you want
it to.

I may be mistaken about this, but I believe that even a Roland
drum brain works the same way. . . the midi notes it's interpreting
(from the dv triggers) don't actually cut each other off, it's just
the synth/tone engine inside the drum brain that is set up to let
the "gate on" of one sound/trigger serve as the "gate off" for another.
If you
were to look at the actual midi output of the device, you wouldn't
see midi notes actually cutting each other off. . . again, this is
speculation. . but I'm pretty sure this is how it works.

I still think that Reason's MIDI learn and mapping features will let
you do exactly what you want to do.  The parameteres in reason that
you want to trigger/adjust must respond to SOME kind of midi
data. . .just re-assing those parameters to respond to what data the
black and
white keys CAN send.

If you care to go into more detail about what version of Reason, what
instrument, and exactly what you're trying to do word-for-word with
the Axiom in realtion to your reason setup. . we can keep working on
this
and see what can be done.

cheers,

cF

#26 From: Don Kim <dkimcg@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 7:34 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
kaleuphornia
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I saw that article, which works for me, I'm on an old 001 running 6.4.  I think that and another post I saw helped get me where I am with the keystation.
I'm planning on upgrading my interface later this year, still deciding if I'll stick with protools and an 002, or jump to a completely new interface/software combo.  The Mac and Logic or Performer look apealing to me for the latter choice.  Think I could upgrade a copy of Performer from 1988?  I had 1.0 on a MacSE before I gave up music for about a couple decades.  :)
 
I'll have to dig some more for the control numbers on protool's side.  Thanks. 
 
 

controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...> wrote:

--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@...> wrote:
>
> I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in protools. I
> found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the ksp and
> the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to refer
> to the midi guide for this sort or stuff. Where is this guide? OR is
> there a learn function in protools? It's a shame having those 27 nobs
> and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools. :)
>
> I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
> Thanks.
>
> Any other Protools users here?
What version of protools are you using? HD 7, M-Powered 7, LE 7?
Here is some info from 2004, but I'm not sure if it's still relevant:
I'm still investigating. . . but anyone else who has some info should please chime in.
-cF
 
 
 
 
 

>


#25 From: "thabias" <thabias@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 7:13 pm
Subject: Re: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
thabias
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "controlphr33k"
<controlphr33k@...> wrote:
>
> --- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "thabias" <thabias@> wrote:
> >
> > I'm trying to customize my own drum kit layout using the white keys
> > mainly.  I have a kit setup in Reason 3.0 Redrum using it's 10
> tracks
> > and I'd like to map the kick to low C and low D to have a "double
> > bass" along with double snare etc... By default I have to transpose
> > down 1 octave (-1) to have the first 10 keyboard keys mapped to the
> 10
> > tracks (36-45cc).  I've read the manual and they mention how to
> > program the different "midi controls", such as the rotary encoders,
> > but not the keyboard keys (unless I'm totally missing something
> which
> > is possible since I have it only 3 days).  If anyone has any ideas,
> > would love to hear them! Thanks.
>
> The only cc related to the white/black keys that you can remap is the
> Aftertouch data, which is the pressure data sent after the initial
> midi gate-on message when pressing down on a key.  This data is not
> suitable for triggering drums. In most any application or hardware
> where sounds are being triggered, it is MIDI gate on-off and note
> value data that is doing the triggering, not CC data.
>
> I don't know of any MIDI controller that allows the user to assign
> new note values to the white/black chromatic keys.  If you want to
> trigger drums with a specific key on your Axiom, you're going to have
> to remap within Reason, not with the Axiom.  Within Reason, you will
> map a specific sample (a slot in Redrum for example) to respond to
> whatever MIDI note value the key you're mapping to sends out.
>
> I don't use reason that often, and don't have it with me right now. .
> but there is a Reason "MIDI learn function" tutorial in the files
> section.
>
> Enigma would have come in handy for you in this situation. . .Launch
> it, and you would have seen that there is no way to change the values
> being sent out by individual chromatic keys.
>
> Let us know if this doesn't clear things up.
>
> thanks for posting!
>
> cF
>



Ok I tried that but it's not exactly what I wanted to do.  I have to
sort of assign the kick to override the snare D#2 in order that the
origianl kick which is C#2 is next to it.  It's definitely better, but
again, I thought I'd be able to assign notes to any key. Just like
Reason has the overrides, I thought you could override anything on the
keyboard.  I'll keep searching. Then again, my roland vdrum kit will
do fine once it's here :)  Thanks!
-scott-

#24 From: "Paul Kotheimer" <pkotheimer@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 6:38 pm
Subject: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
pk505505
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protools is pretty much abhorred by midi intensive people.  I don't know for sure, but I would imagine there is no MIDI learn function like in sonar, logic, etc..  not to say that using one of these programs makes everything perfect:)
paul

On 7/23/06, kaleuphornia <dkimcg@...> wrote:

I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in protools. I
found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the ksp and
the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to refer
to the midi guide for this sort or stuff. Where is this guide? OR is
there a learn function in protools? It's a shame having those 27 nobs
and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools. :)

I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
Thanks.

Any other Protools users here?



#23 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 6:37 pm
Subject: Re: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 


--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@...> wrote:
>
> I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in protools. I
> found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the ksp and
> the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to refer
> to the midi guide for this sort or stuff. Where is this guide? OR is
> there a learn function in protools? It's a shame having those 27 nobs
> and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools. :)
>
> I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
> Thanks.
>
> Any other Protools users here?

What version of protools are you using? HD 7, M-Powered 7, LE 7?

Here is some info from 2004, but I'm not sure if it's still relevant:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may04/articles/protoolsnotes.htm

I'm still investigating. . . but anyone else who has some info should please chime in.

-cF

 

 

 

 

 


>


#22 From: "kaleuphornia" <dkimcg@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 6:15 pm
Subject: Keystation88, Enigma, and Protools?
kaleuphornia
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
I've been looking all over the web for the CC numbers in protools.  I
found the ones to assign the levels fader to the faders on the ksp and
the transport controls, and the protools documentation said to refer
to the midi guide for this sort or stuff.  Where is this guide?  OR is
there a learn function in protools?  It's a shame having those 27 nobs
and 9 buttons under the faders doing nothing in protools.  :)

I just got the keystationpro, so please dummy up any responses.
Thanks.

Any other Protools users here?

#21 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 5:53 pm
Subject: Re: Bank change
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 


--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Kotheimer" <pkotheimer@...> wrote:
>
> controlphr33k--
>
> Thanks so much for the advice. I finally sent a bank change today. I
> wasn't sending you everything in the manual after all. Thank heavens Roland
> is putting their manuals online now because I would have been lost without
> that pdf.
>
> I AM interested in sending the buttons below the knobs as bank change--it
> seems that one should be able to do this. I am using them now to send the 0
> and 32 bank changes, but I'm not sure if I can use the enigma software to
> set up the keys to do this.
>
> the ones I need are like this:
>
> MSB LSB
> 87 00
> 87 64
> 87 65
> 87 66
> 87 etc all the way to 71
>
> So anyway if you could advise that part of it, I would appreciate further.
> this is a great resource already and I know m-audio is selling a ton of
> those controllers because of the way they're priced. there must be a lot of
> people in the same boat as me, the manual could not be more confusing.
>
> pk

Oh man, this is such a good question. . . as this is one of the areas where the Enigma supported products really shine.

So. . . to send a bank change with the MIDI buttons below the sliders you're going to utilize the cool "extended MIDI CC#s" that are unique to the Enigma-supported products.

Rather than try to explain what's going on with all the CC#s that go beyond the standard 127 (everything in midi is usually 7-bit, meaing every value has 128 steps, 0-127) I'm just goign to link (once again) to the M-Audio Knowledge base:

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=c244e4860af5fffb5dc4ce4aea148403

So (as we can see from the KSP88 manual, the Axiom manual, pretty much any manual that has the extended CC chart) extended CC 145 is the cc we want to use, as that CC can send out a bank msb and lsb in one message. . . . which is damn helpful.

So in Enigma you'll double click on the KSP88 button you want to assign, and in the little data dialog that pops up, you'll assign that button to CC 145 and enter your MSB and LSB data. . . .and that's it!  if you just want to get to a specific bank, assign the program data (also in that pop-up) to zero, and you'll be at the start of each bank. . .if you want a specific program within a certain bank. . I do believe that entering the program number as the third bit of data in that dialog will work for that. . . haven't had a chance to try something that specific with CC 145 yet (I'm away from the studio gear right now).

(of course, uploading and downloading sysex data in Enigma has a bit of a learning curve, so check out the "How to use Engima" pdf in the files section if you've never done an upload/download with Enigma before).

Let us know if this lets you do what you were hoping.

thanks for posting!

cF

 

 


#20 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 5:18 pm
Subject: Re: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
controlphr33k
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "thabias" <thabias@...> wrote:
>
> I'm trying to customize my own drum kit layout using the white keys
> mainly.  I have a kit setup in Reason 3.0 Redrum using it's 10
tracks
> and I'd like to map the kick to low C and low D to have a "double
> bass" along with double snare etc... By default I have to transpose
> down 1 octave (-1) to have the first 10 keyboard keys mapped to the
10
> tracks (36-45cc).  I've read the manual and they mention how to
> program the different "midi controls", such as the rotary encoders,
> but not the keyboard keys (unless I'm totally missing something
which
> is possible since I have it only 3 days).  If anyone has any ideas,
> would love to hear them! Thanks.

The only cc related to the white/black keys that you can remap is the
Aftertouch data, which is the pressure data sent after the initial
midi gate-on message when pressing down on a key.  This data is not
suitable for triggering drums. In most any application or hardware
where sounds are being triggered, it is MIDI gate on-off and note
value data that is doing the triggering, not CC data.

I don't know of any MIDI controller that allows the user to assign
new note values to the white/black chromatic keys.  If you want to
trigger drums with a specific key on your Axiom, you're going to have
to remap within Reason, not with the Axiom.  Within Reason, you will
map a specific sample (a slot in Redrum for example) to respond to
whatever MIDI note value the key you're mapping to sends out.

I don't use reason that often, and don't have it with me right now. .
but there is a Reason "MIDI learn function" tutorial in the files
section.

Enigma would have come in handy for you in this situation. . .Launch
it, and you would have seen that there is no way to change the values
being sent out by individual chromatic keys.

Let us know if this doesn't clear things up.

thanks for posting!

cF

#19 From: "thabias" <thabias@...>
Date: Sun Jul 23, 2006 3:47 pm
Subject: How would one reprogram the white/black key CC notes?
thabias
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I'm trying to customize my own drum kit layout using the white keys
mainly.  I have a kit setup in Reason 3.0 Redrum using it's 10 tracks
and I'd like to map the kick to low C and low D to have a "double
bass" along with double snare etc... By default I have to transpose
down 1 octave (-1) to have the first 10 keyboard keys mapped to the 10
tracks (36-45cc).  I've read the manual and they mention how to
program the different "midi controls", such as the rotary encoders,
but not the keyboard keys (unless I'm totally missing something which
is possible since I have it only 3 days).  If anyone has any ideas,
would love to hear them! Thanks.

#18 From: "Paul Kotheimer" <pkotheimer@...>
Date: Sat Jul 22, 2006 7:41 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Bank change
pk505505
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controlphr33k--

Thanks so much for the advice.  I finally sent a bank change today.  I wasn't sending you everything in the manual after all.  Thank heavens Roland is putting their manuals online now because I would have been lost without that pdf.  

I AM interested in sending the buttons below the knobs as bank change--it seems that one should be able to do this.  I am using them now to send the 0 and 32 bank changes, but I'm not sure if I can use the enigma software to set up the keys to do this.

the ones I need are like this:

MSB  LSB
87      00
87      64
87      65
87      66
87      etc all the way to 71

So anyway if you could advise that part of it, I would appreciate further.  this is a great resource already and I know m-audio is selling a ton of those controllers because of the way they're priced.  there must be a lot of people in the same boat as me, the manual could not be more confusing.

pk



On 7/21/06, controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...> wrote:

The following text has be re-posted (with permission) from a private
email correspondence.

Paul wrote:
_______________________________________________________

So to access a bank at msb - 00 and lsb -32:

1. check where msb is at by hitting the MSB button, if it's at 00
leave it alone. If it's at something else, key in "00".

ok

2. hit the lsb button and key in "32". You don't have to hit "enter"
or anything like that. . it will just send out an msb=00 lsb=32
message as soon as the second digit is entred.

ok, that makes sense, I wanted to map the buttons below the dials to
banks, but I can do this if this is how it must be done.

. . .and thats you you send out a bank change with the data you
specified. Pretty easy. . but perhaps you need to do more than just
send out a bank lsb/msb message to accomblish what you're trying
to do?

I'm attaching the bank select part of the midi implementation fo the
xv-5050 manual. check it out and see if you can tell me where to
enter these other numbers for MSB, LSB for the actual bank
change...Thanks SO MUCH.

Paul
__________________________________________________________

OK Paul.

#1 - if this attached info is ALL your sound module documentation
tells you regarding how to do bank selects, then shame on them.

The 0, 32 you see at the top of the documentation (it says "BANK
SELECT: CONTROLLER NUMBER 0, 32) are not the MSB and LSB values, but
the MIDI Control Change (CC) #s used to transmitt MSB and LSB: MIDI CC
0 would be used to send the LSB (if memory serves) and MIDI CC 32
would send the MSB value (I may have those reversed, do some
research). . . the combination of CC 0 and 32 to send bank msb/lsb is
specified in the midi standard, it's not something unique to your
sound module.

The actual msb and lsb values for bank selection are shown in the
chart you provided for your documentation. You use those MSB/LSB
values to select the BANK you want, then you must send a separate
program change message to select the actual program within the bank
that you want.

You had mentioned wanting to use the midi buttons on you KSP 88 to
jump to different banks. . did you want to just change banks, or were
you hoping to jump to a specific sound AND a specific bank?

I uploaded a tutorial doc re: program and bank changes for the Key
Station Pro 88 in the Files section.

cheers.

cF



#17 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sat Jul 22, 2006 6:04 pm
Subject: don't forget to vote in the poll
controlphr33k
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Hi all,

Just a quick reminder to check out the poll in the "Polls" section of
the group.  It's an easy one: "What keyboard are you using"?

Voting in the poll will help me know which MIDI controllers to focus on
for tutorials, etc.  So far we have 3 Keystation 88 Pro users and 2
Axiom users. . . any Trigger Finger or X-Session folks out there?

Thanks!

cF

#16 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sat Jul 22, 2006 5:38 pm
Subject: Re: Axiom info from M-Audio
controlphr33k
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#15 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Sat Jul 22, 2006 4:39 pm
Subject: Axiom info from M-Audio
controlphr33k
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Good nugget of info regarding what happens to you factory presets if
you reset your Aziom:

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?
do=support.faq&ID=cd5ea9fc94e535e3513ca5fefd65b0df

-cF

#14 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:53 pm
Subject: Re: Bank change
controlphr33k
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The following text has be re-posted (with permission) from a private
email correspondence.

Paul wrote:
_______________________________________________________

     So to access a bank at msb - 00 and lsb -32:

     1. check where msb is at by hitting the MSB button, if it's at 00
     leave it alone.  If it's at something else, key in "00".


ok

     2. hit the lsb button and key in "32".  You don't have to hit "enter"
     or anything like that. . it will just send out an msb=00 lsb=32
     message as soon as the second digit is entred.


ok, that makes sense, I wanted to map the buttons below the dials to
banks, but I can do this if this is how it must be done.

     . . .and thats you you send out a bank change with the data you
     specified.  Pretty easy. . but perhaps you need to do more than just
     send out a bank lsb/msb message to accomblish what you're trying
to do?


I'm attaching the bank select part of the midi implementation fo the
xv-5050 manual.  check it out and see if you can tell me where to
enter these other numbers for MSB, LSB for the actual bank
change...Thanks SO MUCH.

Paul
__________________________________________________________________

OK Paul.

#1 - if this attached info is ALL your sound module documentation
tells you regarding how to do bank selects, then shame on them.

The 0, 32 you see at the top of the documentation (it says "BANK
SELECT: CONTROLLER NUMBER 0, 32) are not the MSB and LSB values, but
the MIDI Control Change (CC) #s used to transmitt MSB and LSB: MIDI CC
0 would be used to send the LSB (if memory serves) and MIDI CC 32
would send the MSB value (I may have those reversed, do some
research). . . the combination of CC 0 and 32 to send bank msb/lsb is
specified in the midi standard, it's not something unique to your
sound module.

The actual msb and lsb values for bank selection are shown in the
chart you provided for your documentation.  You use those MSB/LSB
values to select the BANK you want, then you must send a separate
program change message to select the actual program within the bank
that you want.

You had mentioned wanting to use the midi buttons on you KSP 88 to
jump to different banks. . did you want to just change banks, or were
you hoping to jump to a specific sound AND a specific bank?

I uploaded a tutorial doc re: program and bank changes for the Key
Station Pro 88 in the Files section.

cheers.

cF

#13 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Fri Jul 21, 2006 4:50 pm
Subject: Re: I'm a hardcore noob seeking some expert advise
controlphr33k
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--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, "pdptgif" <pdptgif@...> wrote:
>
>
> I am very much a beginner when it comes to setting up parameters but
> all I'm looking for is to be able to use these pads either for redrum
> beats or for sampling sounds from my turntables, like an mpc(if thats
> possible)
>
> Any advice would really be appreciated.
>
> thx
>
> my email is pdptgif@...
>
Hi,

This is a 2-parter:

1. Most (if not all) of the programs on your Axiom should be able to
trigger redrum from the pads by default.  Just click on Redrum and hit
some pads.. .if you're not getting any trigger when you do that. . it
means you haven't properly setup your device to work with reason. . to
set up your keyboard as a Reason 3.0 control surface:

1. In Reason go to Edit/Preferences and choose "Control surfaces and
Keyboards".

2. The Axiom was released after Reason 3.0 came out, so Reason
(obviously) doesn't have a profile already setup for the Axiom. . .
SO, select Add (instead of Auto detect).

3. Select "M-Audio" for the manufacturer and choose "Other - keyboard
with controls" as your device.

4. Give this new Axiom profile a cool name.

5. Select the midi input that represents your Axiom 49.  If you don't
see the Axiom in the list of available midi inputs, then you're
probably running off of the Windows class-compliant usb-midi driver. .
select "usb audio device" if none of the ohter available options
mention the Axiom.

6. click "OK" to save this new profile.  You may want to make the
Axiom your "master keyboard" if it gives you that option. . but I'm
not sure how critical that is.

7. Now select Redrum and hit some pads.


OK. . issue 2.

Using the axiom pads for "sampling beats from (your) turntable".  I'm
SURE you already know what I describe below. . but for the benefit of
anyone that might be confused. . .

The Axiom is a MIDI Controller, not a sampler.  Dedicated midi
controllers like the Axiom, Trigger Finger, or Akai's MPD-16 do NOT
have the ability to record or play back sound of any kind. . .they
have no audio outputs, because they're only designed to ouptup MIDI
data to contorl other sound sources. The Axiom has MPC style pads, but
those pads just send out midi trigger info to trigger samples in an
external sampling engine.  The pads on an actual MPC-
60/1000/2000/3000 do the same thing, but those devices have a sampling
engine built in (that's why they cost so much).  To sample your
turntables and retrigger them you will need a soundcard/audio
interface with an audio input, software to record the audio (like
SoundForge, Bias Peak, Ableton Live, etc), and a sampling engine (such
as the samplers in Reason, Kontakt/Kompakt, any VSTi sampler) to play
back those samples when you send MIDI trigger info from your Axiom.

If you need any further help assiging different kinds of MIDI data to
your Axiom pads, just let us know.

thanks,

cF

#12 From: "pdptgif" <pdptgif@...>
Date: Fri Jul 21, 2006 7:26 am
Subject: I'm a hardcore noob seeking some expert advise
pdptgif
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I seem to be having some trouble with my Axiom 49 and was seeking some
advice from ANYONE who might have an Axiom. I'm sure that those of you
who do own an axiom already are using the trigger pads on the
device... My only questions is how did you get started with the setup
of the trigger pads.

I am very much a beginner when it comes to setting up parameters but
all I'm looking for is to be able to use these pads either for redrum
beats or for sampling sounds from my turntables, like an mpc(if thats
possible)

Any advice would really be appreciated.

thx

my email is pdptgif@...

#11 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:17 am
Subject: Extended MIDI # info.
controlphr33k
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Here's some englightening info from m-audio's website regarding why
your midi controller has Control Change numbers that go beyond the
standard 127.

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=c244e4860af5fffb5dc4ce4aea148\
403

-cF

#7 From: CocoFrogs <CocoFrogs@...>
Date: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:28 pm
Subject: Re: Bank Select
cocofrogs
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I second that!!!!

I think that A59/A60 can be used as a Decement/Increment
keys tied to a VST. But that would require an accumulator
to keep track of your reference. So, I'm assuming a program
has to interpret the A59/A60 to control your VST. Maybe
I should just call M-Audio and see if the Pro88 can send
variable commands instead of specific.

If you find anything out, let me/us know!!!!!!

CocoFrogs

--- pk505505 <pkotheimer@...> wrote:

> Doing bank selects from the Keystation Pro 88 is something I've been
> trying to do FOREVER.  In fact I was excited to see this group and
> thinking I may be able to crack this code.
>
> Can someone post detailed step by step instructions on how they've
> done it.   Even if it's not the synth I'm trying to control (roland
> xv-5050), I'd still be interested in how you've done it.
>
> For the XV-5050, the bank select method is supposed to be MSB - 00
> LSB-32, but I don't know how to actually set up the banks with
> these...also I think I have to press 2 buttons, one with the MSB and
> one with the LSB, is that correct?  I'm completely lost...the Min/Max
> values are alternately selected  (0 and 127) when I send each of the
> CCs, so because that's essentially a toggle, I'm not sure how to
> proceed.  Thanks in advance.
>
>
>
>
>


__________________________________________________
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#6 From: "pk505505" <pkotheimer@...>
Date: Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:28 pm
Subject: Bank Select
pk505505
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Doing bank selects from the Keystation Pro 88 is something I've been
trying to do FOREVER.  In fact I was excited to see this group and
thinking I may be able to crack this code.

Can someone post detailed step by step instructions on how they've
done it.   Even if it's not the synth I'm trying to control (roland
xv-5050), I'd still be interested in how you've done it.

For the XV-5050, the bank select method is supposed to be MSB - 00
LSB-32, but I don't know how to actually set up the banks with
these...also I think I have to press 2 buttons, one with the MSB and
one with the LSB, is that correct?  I'm completely lost...the Min/Max
values are alternately selected  (0 and 127) when I send each of the
CCs, so because that's essentially a toggle, I'm not sure how to
proceed.  Thanks in advance.

#5 From: "controlphr33k" <controlphr33k@...>
Date: Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:20 pm
Subject: New Poll Created: Which controller?
controlphr33k
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Hi All!

Thank you for joining us.

To kick things off, I thought I'd put up a simple, on-going poll with
a really basic question:

which MIDI contorller are you using?

Don't know good that data will do any of us, but I like voting in
polls, don't you?  It's located in the "Polls" section of the forum
(in the left-hand column, obviously).

Don't be shy with those Enigma questions, and don't forget to check
out the tutorials in the files section!

cheers,

cF

#4 From: "parrott_nicholas" <parrott_nicholas@...>
Date: Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:59 pm
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to M-Audio_Enigma
parrott_nich...
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nice tutorial.  Thanks for posting.

--- In M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com, M-
Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com wrote:
>
>
> Hello,
>
> This email message is a notification to let you know that
> a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the M-Audio_Enigma
> group.
>
>   File        : /How to use Enigma.pdf
>   Uploaded by : controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>
>   Description : Enigma tutorial by J-Rock
>
> You can access this file at the URL:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/M-Audio_Enigma/files/How%20to%20use%
20Enigma.pdf
>
> To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
> http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files
>
> Regards,
>
> controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>
>

#3 From: M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tue Jul 18, 2006 9:15 pm
Subject: New poll for M-Audio_Enigma
M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Send Email Send Email
 
Enter your vote today!  A new poll has been created for the
M-Audio_Enigma group:

Which M-Audio or Evolutions MIDI controller are you using?

   o KesStation Pro 88
   o Trigger Finger
   o Axiom Series
   o Oxygen 8v2, 49, or 61
   o Ozonic
   o O2
   o MK Series
   o UC-33e
   o X-Session


To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/M-Audio_Enigma/surveys?id=1638619

Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups
web site listed above.

Thanks!

#2 From: M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:36 pm
Subject: New file uploaded to M-Audio_Enigma
M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Send Email Send Email
 
Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the M-Audio_Enigma
group.

   File        : /Propellerheads Reason Files/Reason - MIDI Learn.pdf
   Uploaded by : controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>
   Description : Reason MIDI learn tutorial by J-Rock

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/M-Audio_Enigma/files/Propellerheads%20Reason%20Fil\
es/Reason%20-%20MIDI%20Learn.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>

#1 From: M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:17 pm
Subject: New file uploaded to M-Audio_Enigma
M-Audio_Enigma@yahoogroups.com
Send Email Send Email
 
Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the M-Audio_Enigma
group.

   File        : /How to use Enigma.pdf
   Uploaded by : controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>
   Description : Enigma tutorial by J-Rock

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/M-Audio_Enigma/files/How%20to%20use%20Enigma.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

controlphr33k <controlphr33k@...>

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