Here is a tribute to Red McKenzie and the Mound City Blue Blowers. The first
recording is called "There Will Be Some Changes Made".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVdHiwXXQAY&list=UU8Xj_3Djn97bzsjGwKyOBqw

Here is the
  1928 original:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmJA8b-0T3w

However, Andy Schumm and his band adapted the above tune to the style of Mound
City Blue Blowers playing "Hello Lola", which is heard below, first by Schumm
and then by Red.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw0Ysac1Eng&list=UU8Xj_3Djn97bzsjGwKyOBqw

And here is the original 1929 Mound City Blue Blowers recording:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8kQzLbIEu8

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HF_X-cNng2k

an intriguing performance, which might have been discussed when I couldn't give
much attention to this site,

have fun!

Robert R. Calder


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

This session  has been the subject of unending speculation ever since
collectors were aware of it. There are no names in the files and the only
safe attribution is ³unknown².


on 23/01/2013 02:46, ROBERT R. CALDER at serapion@... wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HF_X-cNng2k
>
> an intriguing performance, which might have been discussed when I couldn't
> give much attention to this site,
>
> have fun!
>
> Robert R. Calder
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>

Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
howard@...
Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

No; and it's not Sidney Arodin, either...

Robert Greenwood.

I never supposed it would be Arodin, but I am fond of unending speculation.
Adds a certain acuity to the listening.
Even after being very fond of the track for about forty years.

Especially the coda

cheers!
R


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

"Sidney Arnandan or Arnondrin, better known as Sidney Arodin (March 29, 1901,
Westwego, Louisiana - February 6, 1948, New Orleans) was an American jazz
clarinetist and songwriter, best known for co-writing the pop standard "Lazy
River" with Hoagy Carmichael."


Seeing mention of Sidney Arodin brings up a question which has long been in my
mind -

What was the extent of Arodin's contribution to "Up A Lazy River"?

Composer credits sometimes show words by Carmichael & music by Arodin.

Consider the chromatic labyrinth of the melody - I perceive this as the careful
work of a "progressive" composer.

Is there anything in Arodin's output which points to such ability? What other
songs did he compose? Was he a competent arranger?

To the above questions, I have been re-visiting the wonderful 1928 recordings of
Monk Hazel & His Bienville Roof Orchestra

The horn section of Bonanao, Arodin and Jordy is marvellous. The "consciousness"
of the writing - the arrangements - is unique. Perhaps only surpassed by the
writing of the small-group Bix-arrangements of the same time.

Eugene Chadbourne - AllMusic Guide says:

"Arodin got in on the "little instrument" concept years ahead of avant-garde
players such as the Art Ensemble of Chicago by playing a toy instrument known as
a "tonette" on the record "Sizzling the Blues," an example of the original
thinking that makes him such a unique artist.

Needless to say, Arodin did well from the royalties of "Lazy River," but could
have done much better. He sometimes shares credit with the great songwriter
Hoagy Carmichael for this song. There are also plenty of recordings where it is
Carmichael that gets all the credit, bolstering speculation concerning other
standard songs that Arodin claimed to have written in the early days, only to
sell the rights away for a pittance, sometimes for as little as a bottle of
wine. Any song mentioning rivers is suspect, as this was an Arodin
preoccupation, no doubt dating back to his early years in the music business.
Almost every ditty he is credited with writing has something to do with the
subject. This includes "Drifting on a River," based on the same chord
progression as "Lazy River," apparently just an exercise used by Arodin as a
warm-up on the clarinet. "Lazy River" consists of this progression slowed down
somewhat, with a set of lyrics that Arodin may have found along a riverbank and
Carmichael pushed a bit further downstream."

But I digress -

Arodin is certainly a fine player - who stopped recording in 1934 and died
14years later.

By the way, Arodin never recorded "Up A Lazy River" - the 1930 song which shares
a chord progression of secondary dominants through the circle similar to such
earlier songs as "Shine On, Harvest Moon" - 1908 and "Sweet Georgia Brown" -
1925 - AND -  "Sizzling The Blues" (1928) recorded by the aforementioned Monk
Hazel. I was hoping some of Arodin's prescient warm-up exercise would show-up in
this recording - does it elsewhere?

Cheers,

Andrew Homzy


----------

"Shine On, Harvest Moon" is the name of a popular early-1900s song credited to
the married vaudeville team Nora Bayes and Jack Norworth. It was one of a series
of Moon-related Tin Pan Alley songs of the era. The song was debuted by Bayes
and Norworth in the Ziegfeld Follies of 1908 to great acclaim. It became a pop
standard, and continues to be performed and recorded into the 21st century.

During the vaudeville era, songs were often sold outright, and the purchaser
would become the songwriter of record. John Kenrick's Who's Who In Musicals
credits songwriters Edward Madden and Gus Edwards, while David Ewen's All the
Years of American Popular Music credits Dave Stamper, who contributed songs to
21 editions of the Ziegfeld Follies and was Bayes' pianist from 1903 to 1908.[1]
Vaudeville comic Eddie Cantor also credited Stamper in his 1934 book Ziegfeld -
The Great Glorifier.[2]


"Sweet Georgia Brown" is a jazz standard and pop tune written in 1925 by Ben
Bernie and Maceo Pinkard (music) and Kenneth Casey (lyrics).

The tune was first recorded on March 19, 1925 by bandleader Ben Bernie,
resulting in a five-week No. 1 for Ben Bernie and his Hotel Roosevelt
Orchestra.[1] As Bernie's then nationally famous orchestra did much to
popularize the number, Pinkard cut Bernie in for a share of the tune's royalties
by giving him a co-writer credit to the song.[citation needed]. It is the first
song to have a sax solo.

The late Jules Gallé, clarinetist with the Brunies Brothers band from Biloxi,
Mississippi, knew Arodin well. He told me in the early 1980s:

(1) that the melody of Up a Lazy River was most definitely composed by Arodin
and was in fact derived from an original  practice exercise used regularly by
Arodin as a warm-up;

(2) that Arodin's original title for the piece was "Lazy Nigger" (sic!); and

(3) that, yes, Arodin WAS "colored passing for white." In that racist society
where a black man's efforts attracted something like one tenth of the pay of a
white man's, this was done often enough, by those who could get away with it,
and that his black compatriots used to laugh about the situation, and applauded
his business acumen.

J. T. Dyamond.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

If you search the archives of this group you will find detailed evidence
that Arodin was not of African ancestry, not for many generations anyway,
but I lack the time to dig it all out and present it again. It appears to
have been a very rare instance in which African-Americans were mistaken in
believing that someone was passing. I certainly always accepted that Arodin
was a créole de couleur until Albert Haim (if memory serves) came up with
the actual evidence.


on 24/01/2013 12:41, fearfeasa at fearfeasa@... wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> The late Jules Gallé, clarinetist with the Brunies Brothers band from Biloxi,
> Mississippi, knew Arodin well. He told me in the early 1980s:
>
> (1) that the melody of Up a Lazy River was most definitely composed by Arodin
> and was in fact derived from an original  practice exercise used regularly by
> Arodin as a warm-up;
>
> (2) that Arodin's original title for the piece was "Lazy Nigger" (sic!); and
> 
> (3) that, yes, Arodin WAS "colored passing for white." In that racist society
> where a black man's efforts attracted something like one tenth of the pay of a
> white man's, this was done often enough, by those who could get away with it,
> and that his black compatriots used to laugh about the situation, and
> applauded his business acumen.
>
> J. T. Dyamond.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>

Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
howard@...
Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

What CD(s) have all the Monk Hazel material?

Ronald L'Herault

Lab Supervisor, Biomaterials Division
B.U. School of Dental Medicine
801 Albany Street S203
Roxbury, MA 02119




-----Original Message-----
From: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Andrew Homzy

To the above questions, I have been re-visiting the wonderful 1928
recordings of Monk Hazel & His Bienville Roof Orchestra

Frog DGF5: Sizzling the Blues - New Orleans 1927-29.
Which also includes the Johnnie Miller sides, the Louis Dumaines, the
Jones-Collins Astoria Hot 8.

Robert Greenwood.

--- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Ron L'Herault"  wrote:
>
> What CD(s) have all the Monk Hazel material?
>
> Ronald L'Herault
>
> Lab Supervisor, Biomaterials Division
> B.U. School of Dental Medicine
> 801 Albany Street S203
> Roxbury, MA 02119
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of Andrew Homzy
>
> To the above questions, I have been re-visiting the wonderful 1928
> recordings of Monk Hazel & His Bienville Roof Orchestra
>

Thanks!

Ronald L'Herault

Lab Supervisor, Biomaterials Division
B.U. School of Dental Medicine
801 Albany Street S203
Roxbury, MA 02119




-----Original Message-----
From: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Robert
Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 10:59 AM
To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [RedHotJazz] Re: Sidney Arodin & "Up A Lazy River"

Frog DGF5: Sizzling the Blues - New Orleans 1927-29.
Which also includes the Johnnie Miller sides, the Louis Dumaines, the
Jones-Collins Astoria Hot 8.

Robert Greenwood.

--- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Ron L'Herault"  wrote:
>
> What CD(s) have all the Monk Hazel material?
>
> Ronald L'Herault
>
> Lab Supervisor, Biomaterials Division
> B.U. School of Dental Medicine
> 801 Albany Street S203
> Roxbury, MA 02119
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of Andrew Homzy
>
> To the above questions, I have been re-visiting the wonderful 1928
> recordings of Monk Hazel & His Bienville Roof Orchestra
>




------------------------------------

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If Sidney was "colored passing for white", then it started with his grandparents
- his paternal grandfather (and his 6 children, including Sidney's dad, Victor)
is listed at Westwego in the 1900 census as white.  The rest of the 50 people
listed on that page were also presumably "passing", as they are all listed as
"W" (white).  Victor, his father and his eldest brother were all "Fisherman" -
maybe their attitude to race was temperred by working alongside black fishermen.

20 years later, in New Orleans, Sidney and his wife are again listed as white,
as were all 50 people listed on the page.
 
I realise this doesn't disprove "passing", but if they were passing, the family
did it for decades and they were very successful at it.  And if the family
culture was "white" then it is likely that Sidney thought of himself that way.
 
Unfortunately, this looks like being a comment by a performer designed to curry
favor with an enthusiast.  People like Arodin and Brunies were so involved with
the roots of the music that they shouldn't have felt the need to prove
themselves to be black.
 
Bob
 

________________________________
  From: fearfeasa <fearfeasa@...>
To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2013 11:41 PM
Subject: Re: [RedHotJazz] Sidney Arodin & "Up A Lazy River"


 

The late Jules Gallé, clarinetist with the Brunies Brothers band from Biloxi,
Mississippi, knew Arodin well. He told me in the early 1980s:

(1) that the melody of Up a Lazy River was most definitely composed by Arodin
and was in fact derived from an original  practice exercise used regularly by
Arodin as a warm-up;

(2) that Arodin's original title for the piece was "Lazy Nigger" (sic!); and

(3) that, yes, Arodin WAS "colored passing for white." In that racist society
where a black man's efforts attracted something like one tenth of the pay of a
white man's, this was done often enough, by those who could get away with it,
and that his black compatriots used to laugh about the situation, and applauded
his business acumen.

J. T. Dyamond.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Most of the people living in Westwego in that period had moved there from the
coast from the area around Caminada Bay which was wiped out by a hurricane in
1892. It was a white community.
John McCusker
New Orleans

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 24, 2013, at 3:15 PM, Bob Eagle <prof_hi_jinx@...> wrote:

> If Sidney was "colored passing for white", then it started with his
grandparents - his paternal grandfather (and his 6 children, including Sidney's
dad, Victor) is listed at Westwego in the 1900 census as white.  The rest of the
50 people listed on that page were also presumably "passing", as they are all
listed as "W" (white).  Victor, his father and his eldest brother were all
"Fisherman" - maybe their attitude to race was temperred by working alongside
black fishermen.
>
> 20 years later, in New Orleans, Sidney and his wife are again listed as white,
as were all 50 people listed on the page.
>
> I realise this doesn't disprove "passing", but if they were passing, the
family did it for decades and they were very successful at it.  And if the
family culture was "white" then it is likely that Sidney thought of himself that
way.
>
> Unfortunately, this looks like being a comment by a performer designed to
curry favor with an enthusiast.  People like Arodin and Brunies were so involved
with the roots of the music that they shouldn't have felt the need to prove
themselves to be black.
>
> Bob
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: fearfeasa fearfeasa@...>
> To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2013 11:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [RedHotJazz] Sidney Arodin & "Up A Lazy River"
>
>
>
>
> The late Jules Gallé, clarinetist with the Brunies Brothers band from Biloxi,
Mississippi, knew Arodin well. He told me in the early 1980s:
>
> (1) that the melody of Up a Lazy River was most definitely composed by Arodin
and was in fact derived from an original practice exercise used regularly by
Arodin as a warm-up;
>
> (2) that Arodin's original title for the piece was "Lazy Nigger" (sic!); and
> 
> (3) that, yes, Arodin WAS "colored passing for white." In that racist society
where a black man's efforts attracted something like one tenth of the pay of a
white man's, this was done often enough, by those who could get away with it,
and that his black compatriots used to laugh about the situation, and applauded
his business acumen.
>
> J. T. Dyamond.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I was checking into the Charles Avery-accompanied Lucille Bogan records. The
Godrich and Dixon data on these is FUBAR'ed: the right mx. on "Alley Boogie"
which is C-5563; G&D lists it as "C-6653" and that false number persists
EVERYWHERE. Ross Laird's "Brunswick Records: A Discography of Recordings
1916-1931 v3. Chicago and Regional Sessions" provides the right matrix and
clears up a lot of the errors relating to these dates.

Charles Avery has a very recognizable style within barrelhouse piano; it is
sweeping, gracious and betrays at the back of it a hint of what may have been
some measure of formal training. And I agree that it is Avery on the March 1930
Bogans, at least C-5547 through C-5550. But as to C-5562, C-5563 and the
December session consisting of C-6845 through C-6848, I think these are all the
same pianist, and it's not Charles Avery.

Max Haymes, on a website dated 2001, suggest that C-6847 is either "Eddie Miller
or prob. Frank 'Springback' James." I don't know where he is redacting that from
or if he came up with the attribution on his own, but I don't agree with it. I'm
pretty certain that all of these accompaniments are supplied by Lucille Bogan
herself. The playing is decent, but not typically the work of a professional
accompanist. Bogan was an accomplished songwriter and probably could play well
enough herself to demonstrate her songs to better players or to handle her own
accompaniments in situations where she didn't have anyone to back her. To my
ears, that's what's going on -- it is the elementary playing of a singer
following along with her own vocal line, not of a professional pianist hired to
accompany a well-known singer like Bogan. There is a short bar -- actually two
bars that
have a short beat between them, I'm not sure where yet -- which occurs in C-5563
and in one of the accompaniments in the C-6845 to 48 group. It's exactly the
same figure in both, and I'm pretty sure Avery would not have clipped off the
beat as it is an amateurish feature alien to his basic style.

Laird's work establishes that C-5562 and C-5563 are from a wholly seperate
occasion as C-5547 through C-5550. G&D makes this look as though all of these
masters belong to the same session, but the Laird discography shows that quite a
bit went on between C-5550 and C-5562, including several whole sessions
unrelated to Bogan.

Has anyone a perspective on this? The full on Brunswick ledger stops just before
this period commences, and the only register extant for 1930-31 Brunswick are a
couple of loose, barely filled in sheets. I feel that by adding the word
"unknown" to the descriptor "vocal with piano" we may have missed out on what
that information was trying to tell us?

Agree? Disagree? All of these except "Dirty Treatin' Blues" may be found on
Lucille Bogan's page on redhotjazz.com

And if anyone has the Roots LP RL317 ("Lucille Bogan 1930-1935") I'f love to
hear the alternate of "My Georgia Grind."

thanks,

Uncle Dave Lewis
Lebanon, OH

Godrich & Dixon pp.98-99

[LUCILLE BOGAN]

Acc. unknown, p.
Chicago c. 1 February 1930
C-5547-  My Georgia Grind  Br unissued, Roots RL317 (LP)
C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman 	 Br unissued
C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br unissued

Acc. Charles Avery, p.
Chicago late March 1930
C-5547-  My Georgia Grind  Br 7145
C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman 	 Br 7145
C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br 7163
C-5550-  Dirty Treatin' Blues  Br 7163
C-5562-A Sloppy Drunk Blues  Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro
5122
C-6653-A Alley Boogie 	 Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro 5122

Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.

Acc. unknown, p.
Chicago c. mid-December 1930
C-6845-  Crawlin' Lizard Blues  Br 7193
C-6846-  Struttin' My Stuff  Br 7193
C-6847-A Black Angel Blues  Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro 5121
C-6848-A Tricks Ain't Walking No More Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro
5121
Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.

Dave, the first thing to say is that you must be using an old edition of B&GR -
B&GR4 has the correct mx.
 
That said, I agree that the pianist is not Avery.  I doubt that Lucille is the
player, because of timing issues, although her son and his best friend both said
she could play piano - they just don't sound self-accompanied.
 
One "Smith" shares composer credits on "Black Angel", which may be a hint.
 
However, there is another issue.  To my ears, the pianist on "Whiskey Selling
Woman" (C-5548) is different again - great left hand, interesting and variable
right, far more swinging than either Avery or the later pianist.  If it *is*
Avery, he's playing way above himself!
 
I'm tempted to say Bill O'Bryant, who recorded an excellent title with Tampa Red
at about this time, but there are differences.  Nevertheless, it is a
forward-thinking accompaniment, hinting at what Maceo would later do. 
 
Lucille had to wait for Walter Roland to find a better accompanist - unless it
is a young Roland!  Lucille was living in Chicago at this time, and (so far at
least) there is no evidence that Roland left Alabama.
 
Bob


________________________________
  From: Uncle Dave <udtv@...>
To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2013 6:09 PM
Subject: [RedHotJazz] Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery


 

I was checking into the Charles Avery-accompanied Lucille Bogan records. The
Godrich and Dixon data on these is FUBAR'ed: the right mx. on "Alley Boogie"
which is C-5563; G&D lists it as "C-6653" and that false number persists
EVERYWHERE. Ross Laird's "Brunswick Records: A Discography of Recordings
1916-1931 v3. Chicago and Regional Sessions" provides the right matrix and
clears up a lot of the errors relating to these dates.

Charles Avery has a very recognizable style within barrelhouse piano; it is
sweeping, gracious and betrays at the back of it a hint of what may have been
some measure of formal training. And I agree that it is Avery on the March 1930
Bogans, at least C-5547 through C-5550. But as to C-5562, C-5563 and the
December session consisting of C-6845 through C-6848, I think these are all the
same pianist, and it's not Charles Avery.

Max Haymes, on a website dated 2001, suggest that C-6847 is either "Eddie Miller
or prob. Frank 'Springback' James." I don't know where he is redacting that from
or if he came up with the attribution on his own, but I don't agree with it. I'm
pretty certain that all of these accompaniments are supplied by Lucille Bogan
herself. The playing is decent, but not typically the work of a professional
accompanist. Bogan was an accomplished songwriter and probably could play well
enough herself to demonstrate her songs to better players or to handle her own
accompaniments in situations where she didn't have anyone to back her. To my
ears, that's what's going on -- it is the elementary playing of a singer
following along with her own vocal line, not of a professional pianist hired to
accompany a well-known singer like Bogan. There is a short bar -- actually two
bars that
have a short beat between them, I'm not sure where yet -- which occurs in C-5563
and in one of the accompaniments in the C-6845 to 48 group. It's exactly the
same figure in both, and I'm pretty sure Avery would not have clipped off the
beat as it is an amateurish feature alien to his basic style.

Laird's work establishes that C-5562 and C-5563 are from a wholly seperate
occasion as C-5547 through C-5550. G&D makes this look as though all of these
masters belong to the same session, but the Laird discography shows that quite a
bit went on between C-5550 and C-5562, including several whole sessions
unrelated to Bogan.

Has anyone a perspective on this? The full on Brunswick ledger stops just before
this period commences, and the only register extant for 1930-31 Brunswick are a
couple of loose, barely filled in sheets. I feel that by adding the word
"unknown" to the descriptor "vocal with piano" we may have missed out on what
that information was trying to tell us?

Agree? Disagree? All of these except "Dirty Treatin' Blues" may be found on
Lucille Bogan's page on redhotjazz.com

And if anyone has the Roots LP RL317 ("Lucille Bogan 1930-1935") I'f love to
hear the alternate of "My Georgia Grind."

thanks,

Uncle Dave Lewis
Lebanon, OH

Godrich & Dixon pp.98-99

[LUCILLE BOGAN]

Acc. unknown, p.
Chicago c. 1 February 1930
C-5547-  My Georgia Grind  Br unissued, Roots RL317 (LP)
C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman 	 Br unissued
C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br unissued

Acc. Charles Avery, p.
Chicago late March 1930
C-5547-  My Georgia Grind  Br 7145
C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman 	 Br 7145
C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br 7163
C-5550-  Dirty Treatin' Blues  Br 7163
C-5562-A Sloppy Drunk Blues  Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro
5122
C-6653-A Alley Boogie 	 Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro 5122

Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.

Acc. unknown, p.
Chicago c. mid-December 1930
C-6845-  Crawlin' Lizard Blues  Br 7193
C-6846-  Struttin' My Stuff  Br 7193
C-6847-A Black Angel Blues  Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro 5121
C-6848-A Tricks Ain't Walking No More Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro
5121
Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The wrong matrix number was simply an (obvious) typo in the 3rd edition
(mine I¹m afraid, not spotted by our two eminent proof-readers). It is
correct in the 2nd edition, as well as the 4th. Doesn¹t seem worth checking
the 1st edition. (Be interested to know where else the ³EVERYWHERE² is
because it is prima facie proof of uncritical copying, which is of course
endemic in discography, but in this case mindless as the typo is so obvious.
If only people copied my corrections as enthusiastically as they copy and
castigate my typos. Sigh!)

I¹ll check to see whether there is any file data on the pianist. The naming
of Avery goes back to B&GR1. Jazz Directory has only a collective personnel
for the Brunswicks and it looks as though Orin Blackstone didn¹t know about
them.

I think you will listen in vain for an alternative take on Roots RL317. They
were working from tapes not 78s and simply and carelessly quoted the first
matrix number they came to, 5347, rather than the correct 5547, or maybe
it¹s just a typo, and they always really knew they were issuing 5547  (This
was checked aurally long ago and there is a note to this effect in B&GR4)

on 26/01/2013 08:35, Bob Eagle at prof_hi_jinx@... wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> Dave, the first thing to say is that you must be using an old edition of B&GR
> - B&GR4 has the correct mx.
>
> That said, I agree that the pianist is not Avery.  I doubt that Lucille is the
> player, because of timing issues, although her son and his best friend both
> said she could play piano - they just don't sound self-accompanied.
>
> One "Smith" shares composer credits on "Black Angel", which may be a hint.
>
> However, there is another issue.  To my ears, the pianist on "Whiskey Selling
> Woman" (C-5548) is different again - great left hand, interesting and variable
> right, far more swinging than either Avery or the later pianist.  If it *is*
> Avery, he's playing way above himself!
>
> I'm tempted to say Bill O'Bryant, who recorded an excellent title with Tampa
> Red at about this time, but there are differences.  Nevertheless, it is a
> forward-thinking accompaniment, hinting at what Maceo would later do.
>
> Lucille had to wait for Walter Roland to find a better accompanist - unless it
> is a young Roland!  Lucille was living in Chicago at this time, and (so far at
> least) there is no evidence that Roland left Alabama.
>
> Bob
>
>
> ________________________________
>  From: Uncle Dave udtv@... <mailto:udtv%40yahoo.com> >
> To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RedHotJazz%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2013 6:09 PM
> Subject: [RedHotJazz] Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery
>
>
>
>
> I was checking into the Charles Avery-accompanied Lucille Bogan records. The
> Godrich and Dixon data on these is FUBAR'ed: the right mx. on "Alley Boogie"
> which is C-5563; G&D lists it as "C-6653" and that false number persists
> EVERYWHERE. Ross Laird's "Brunswick Records: A Discography of Recordings
> 1916-1931 v3. Chicago and Regional Sessions" provides the right matrix and
> clears up a lot of the errors relating to these dates.
>
> Charles Avery has a very recognizable style within barrelhouse piano; it is
> sweeping, gracious and betrays at the back of it a hint of what may have been
> some measure of formal training. And I agree that it is Avery on the March
> 1930 Bogans, at least C-5547 through C-5550. But as to C-5562, C-5563 and the
> December session consisting of C-6845 through C-6848, I think these are all
> the same pianist, and it's not Charles Avery.
>
> Max Haymes, on a website dated 2001, suggest that C-6847 is either "Eddie
> Miller or prob. Frank 'Springback' James." I don't know where he is redacting
> that from or if he came up with the attribution on his own, but I don't agree
> with it. I'm pretty certain that all of these accompaniments are supplied by
> Lucille Bogan herself. The playing is decent, but not typically the work of a
> professional accompanist. Bogan was an accomplished songwriter and probably
> could play well enough herself to demonstrate her songs to better players or
> to handle her own accompaniments in situations where she didn't have anyone to
> back her. To my ears, that's what's going on -- it is the elementary playing
> of a singer following along with her own vocal line, not of a professional
> pianist hired to accompany a well-known singer like Bogan. There is a short
> bar -- actually two bars that
> have a short beat between them, I'm not sure where yet -- which occurs in
> C-5563 and in one of the accompaniments in the C-6845 to 48 group. It's
> exactly the same figure in both, and I'm pretty sure Avery would not have
> clipped off the beat as it is an amateurish feature alien to his basic style.
>
> Laird's work establishes that C-5562 and C-5563 are from a wholly seperate
> occasion as C-5547 through C-5550. G&D makes this look as though all of these
> masters belong to the same session, but the Laird discography shows that quite
> a bit went on between C-5550 and C-5562, including several whole sessions
> unrelated to Bogan.
>
> Has anyone a perspective on this? The full on Brunswick ledger stops just
> before this period commences, and the only register extant for 1930-31
> Brunswick are a couple of loose, barely filled in sheets. I feel that by
> adding the word "unknown" to the descriptor "vocal with piano" we may have
> missed out on what that information was trying to tell us?
>
> Agree? Disagree? All of these except "Dirty Treatin' Blues" may be found on
> Lucille Bogan's page on redhotjazz.com
>
> And if anyone has the Roots LP RL317 ("Lucille Bogan 1930-1935") I'f love to
> hear the alternate of "My Georgia Grind."
>
> thanks,
>
> Uncle Dave Lewis
> Lebanon, OH
>
> Godrich & Dixon pp.98-99
>
> [LUCILLE BOGAN]
>
> Acc. unknown, p.
> Chicago c. 1 February 1930
> C-5547-  My Georgia Grind Br unissued, Roots RL317 (LP)
> C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman Br unissued
> C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br unissued
>
> Acc. Charles Avery, p.
> Chicago late March 1930
> C-5547-  My Georgia Grind Br 7145
> C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman Br 7145
> C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br 7163
> C-5550-  Dirty Treatin' Blues Br 7163
> C-5562-A Sloppy Drunk Blues Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro
> 5122
> C-6653-A Alley Boogie Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro 5122
>
> Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.
>
> Acc. unknown, p.
> Chicago c. mid-December 1930
> C-6845-  Crawlin' Lizard Blues Br 7193
> C-6846-  Struttin' My Stuff Br 7193
> C-6847-A Black Angel Blues Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro 5121
> C-6848-A Tricks Ain't Walking No More Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro
> 5121
> Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>

Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
howard@...
Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I should perhaps also have said that B&GR4 lists all the intervening
matrices in its session note:
C-5551/2 by Willie Harris
C-5553-59 untraced at that point
C-5560/61 by Freddie Nicholson (yet another typo has these as 5561/62, but
that has been corrected in the amendment service, and is correct at
Nickerson who is also given with accompaniment by Charels Avery.)

I don¹t have Laird to hand so don¹t know whether he has traced C-5553-9, but
no pretence is made that the Bogan¹s are from the same session or that they
are not from the same session because in the absence of file information, no
one actually knows, unless Laird has some file data which has not been
available to other discographers. As far as B&GR is concerned, unless an
exact date is given with the day of the week, recording dates are no more
than educated guesses and must be interpreted by the reader on the basis of
the evidence given.

The naming of Avery for Nickerson also goes back to B&GR1. There is no
personnel in Index to Jazz.


on 26/01/2013 07:09, Uncle Dave at udtv@... wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> I was checking into the Charles Avery-accompanied Lucille Bogan records. The
> Godrich and Dixon data on these is FUBAR'ed: the right mx. on "Alley Boogie"
> which is C-5563; G&D lists it as "C-6653" and that false number persists
> EVERYWHERE. Ross Laird's "Brunswick Records: A Discography of Recordings
> 1916-1931 v3. Chicago and Regional Sessions" provides the right matrix and
> clears up a lot of the errors relating to these dates.
>
> Charles Avery has a very recognizable style within barrelhouse piano; it is
> sweeping, gracious and betrays at the back of it a hint of what may have been
> some measure of formal training. And I agree that it is Avery on the March
> 1930 Bogans, at least C-5547 through C-5550. But as to C-5562, C-5563 and the
> December session consisting of C-6845 through C-6848, I think these are all
> the same pianist, and it's not Charles Avery.
>
> Max Haymes, on a website dated 2001, suggest that C-6847 is either "Eddie
> Miller or prob. Frank 'Springback' James." I don't know where he is redacting
> that from or if he came up with the attribution on his own, but I don't agree
> with it. I'm pretty certain that all of these accompaniments are supplied by
> Lucille Bogan herself. The playing is decent, but not typically the work of a
> professional accompanist. Bogan was an accomplished songwriter and probably
> could play well enough herself to demonstrate her songs to better players or
> to handle her own accompaniments in situations where she didn't have anyone to
> back her. To my ears, that's what's going on -- it is the elementary playing
> of a singer following along with her own vocal line, not of a professional
> pianist hired to accompany a well-known singer like Bogan. There is a short
> bar -- actually two bars that
> have a short beat between them, I'm not sure where yet -- which occurs in
> C-5563 and in one of the accompaniments in the C-6845 to 48 group. It's
> exactly the same figure in both, and I'm pretty sure Avery would not have
> clipped off the beat as it is an amateurish feature alien to his basic style.
>
> Laird's work establishes that C-5562 and C-5563 are from a wholly seperate
> occasion as C-5547 through C-5550. G&D makes this look as though all of these
> masters belong to the same session, but the Laird discography shows that quite
> a bit went on between C-5550 and C-5562, including several whole sessions
> unrelated to Bogan.
>
> Has anyone a perspective on this? The full on Brunswick ledger stops just
> before this period commences, and the only register extant for 1930-31
> Brunswick are a couple of loose, barely filled in sheets. I feel that by
> adding the word "unknown" to the descriptor "vocal with piano" we may have
> missed out on what that information was trying to tell us?
>
> Agree? Disagree? All of these except "Dirty Treatin' Blues" may be found on
> Lucille Bogan's page on redhotjazz.com
>
> And if anyone has the Roots LP RL317 ("Lucille Bogan 1930-1935") I'f love to
> hear the alternate of "My Georgia Grind."
>
> thanks,
>
> Uncle Dave Lewis
> Lebanon, OH
>
> Godrich & Dixon pp.98-99
>
> [LUCILLE BOGAN]
>
> Acc. unknown, p.
> Chicago c. 1 February 1930
> C-5547-  My Georgia Grind Br unissued, Roots RL317 (LP)
> C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman Br unissued
> C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br unissued
>
> Acc. Charles Avery, p.
> Chicago late March 1930
> C-5547-  My Georgia Grind Br 7145
> C-5548-  Whiskey Selling WOman Br 7145
> C-5549-  They Ain't Walking No More Br 7163
> C-5550-  Dirty Treatin' Blues Br 7163
> C-5562-A Sloppy Drunk Blues Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro
> 5122
> C-6653-A Alley Boogie Br 7210, Ba 32390, Me M12484, Or 8122, Pe 198, Ro 5122
>
> Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.
>
> Acc. unknown, p.
> Chicago c. mid-December 1930
> C-6845-  Crawlin' Lizard Blues Br 7193
> C-6846-  Struttin' My Stuff Br 7193
> C-6847-A Black Angel Blues Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro 5121
> C-6848-A Tricks Ain't Walking No More Br 7186, Ba 32389, Or 8121, Pe 197, Ro
> 5121
> Banner, Melotone, Oriole, Perfect, and Romeo issues as by Bessie Jackson.
>
>
>
>
>

Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
howard@...
Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you Bob and Howard for your comments, and I wanted to qualify that I'm not
trying to bust anyone's chops here. Avery, of course, only has one surviving
solo, "Dearborn Street Breakdown," but it's quite distinctive and I was lurking
around in the accompaniments accredited to him out of interest and stumbled upon
these Bogan sides that do not fit his style.

Bob wrote:

Dave, the first thing to say is that you must be using an old edition of B&GR -
B&GR4 has the correct mx.

Howard wrote:

Be interested to know where else the ³EVERYWHERE² is because it is prima facie
proof of uncritical copying, which is of course
endemic in discography, but in this case mindless as the typo is so obvious.

>>>

OK -- indeed, mine is BG&R3. Apologies to Howard as well. By "everywhere" I mean
only a few places I looked; actually the correct number is at least seen in Ty
Settlemaier's ODP and so it went into the Abrahms data correctly.

>>>

Bob wrote:

That said, I agree that the pianist is not Avery. I doubt that Lucille is the
player, because of timing issues, although her son and his best friend both said
she could play piano - they just don't sound self-accompanied. One "Smith"
shares composer credits on "Black Angel", which may be a hint.

However, there is another issue. To my ears, the pianist on "Whiskey Selling
Woman" (C-5548) is different again - great left hand, interesting and variable
right, far more swinging than either Avery or the later pianist. If it *is*
Avery, he's playing way above himself! I'm tempted to say Bill O'Bryant, who
recorded an excellent title with Tampa Red at about this time, but there are
differences. Nevertheless, it is a forward-thinking accompaniment, hinting at
what Maceo would later do.

>>>

While I don't find the playing on "Whiskey Selling Woman" inconsistent with
Avery -- the rising, locked hand tremolandi figure in this accompaniment also
appears, in part, in "Dirty Treatin' Blues" -- I agree that it is an astonishing
performance. Each verse is treated like a variation on its own, with an
evolutionary sense of brilliance throughout. I've not yet heard the Bill
O'Bryant side, but I will investigate it, and thanks for the suggestion.

I note in my BG&R3 that the side on which O'Bryant plays is listed as "C-5563
1/2", so that takes me back to the discographical end of things.

Howard wrote:

I think you will listen in vain for an alternative take on Roots RL317. They
were working from tapes not 78s and simply and carelessly quoted the first
matrix number they came to, 5347, rather than the correct 5547, or maybe it's
just a typo, and they always really knew they were issuing 5547 (This was
checked aurally long ago and there is a note to this effect in B&GR4)

>>>

Thanks Howard; now I know not to look for that. Here, in summary form, is the
data that Laird gathers for the matrix range we are discussing. At the time,
Brunswick was also cutting sessions for a label called Majestic which was a
product of the Grigsby-Grunow Radio Corp. Though through acquisition the
"Majestic" name did end up used in the 1940s for a commercial label, there is no
relationship between this one and the later one. 1929-31 Majestic was a personal
label like Gennett's "Personal." Hardly any of these records have been found,
but the empty stock numbers figure significantly in the 1930 Brunswick ledger.
Client work for the National Radio Advertising Co. also has a presence in the
Brunswick book of 1930.

C5312-C5349 all personal recordings, unknown (Majestic?)
this would include C5347-C5349 credited to Bogan and dated "ca. February 1,
1930"; suggesting as you have that the session does not exist.
C5350-C5352 Ben Bernie
C5353 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson
C5354 Charles Avery
C5355-C5357 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson & J.[H. "Freddie"] Shayne

C5540-C5546 all personal recordings, unknown (Majestic?)
C5547-C5550 Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery
C5551-C5552 Willie Harris
XC5553-XC5554 Quin A. Ryan (Majestic, from dubbed masters)
C5555-C5557 No details
C5558-C5559 Bradley Kincaid
C5560-C5561 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson & Charles Avery
C5562-C5563 Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery
C5563 1/2 Tampa Red vocal with guitar
C5564 Tampa Red vocal with guitar & piano
C5565-C5575 No details
XC5576-XC5577 Quin A. Ryan (different dub of XC5553-XC5554)
C5578-C5579 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom

C6843-C6844 No details
C6845-C6848 Lucille Bogan
C6849-C6850 Kansas City Kitty & Georgia Tom
C6851-C6852 No details
C6853-C6856 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom
C6857 No details
C6858-C6859 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom
C6860-C6864 No details (not used?)
C6865-C6876 Bradley Kincaid, recorded in 1931 and not issued on Brunswick

Note that O'Bryant is mentioned for C5563 1/2, whereas C5564 is shown as the
side that has the piano. This is an error, but I note that O'Bryant's credit is
carried only on the label copy and may not have noted in the log that Ross was
reading.

David N. Lewis
Lebanon, OH

For what¹s it¹s worth, I am sure we can take it that there is more than one
session here, and that therefore there is no reason that whatever evidence
someone may have had for Avery (and it probably goes back too far to find
out) would apply to all the masters involved.


on 26/01/2013 16:48, Uncle Dave at udtv@... wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> Thank you Bob and Howard for your comments, and I wanted to qualify that I'm
> not trying to bust anyone's chops here. Avery, of course, only has one
> surviving solo, "Dearborn Street Breakdown," but it's quite distinctive and I
> was lurking around in the accompaniments accredited to him out of interest and
> stumbled upon these Bogan sides that do not fit his style.
>
> Bob wrote:
>
> Dave, the first thing to say is that you must be using an old edition of B&GR
> - B&GR4 has the correct mx.
>
> Howard wrote:
>
> Be interested to know where else the ³EVERYWHERE² is because it is prima facie
> proof of uncritical copying, which is of course
> endemic in discography, but in this case mindless as the typo is so obvious.
>
>>>> >>>
>
> OK -- indeed, mine is BG&R3. Apologies to Howard as well. By "everywhere" I
> mean only a few places I looked; actually the correct number is at least seen
> in Ty Settlemaier's ODP and so it went into the Abrahms data correctly.
>
>>>> >>>
>
> Bob wrote:
>
> That said, I agree that the pianist is not Avery. I doubt that Lucille is the
> player, because of timing issues, although her son and his best friend both
> said she could play piano - they just don't sound self-accompanied. One
> "Smith" shares composer credits on "Black Angel", which may be a hint.
>
> However, there is another issue. To my ears, the pianist on "Whiskey Selling
> Woman" (C-5548) is different again - great left hand, interesting and variable
> right, far more swinging than either Avery or the later pianist. If it *is*
> Avery, he's playing way above himself! I'm tempted to say Bill O'Bryant, who
> recorded an excellent title with Tampa Red at about this time, but there are
> differences. Nevertheless, it is a forward-thinking accompaniment, hinting at
> what Maceo would later do.
>
>>>> >>>
>
> While I don't find the playing on "Whiskey Selling Woman" inconsistent with
> Avery -- the rising, locked hand tremolandi figure in this accompaniment also
> appears, in part, in "Dirty Treatin' Blues" -- I agree that it is an
> astonishing performance. Each verse is treated like a variation on its own,
> with an evolutionary sense of brilliance throughout. I've not yet heard the
> Bill O'Bryant side, but I will investigate it, and thanks for the suggestion.
>
> I note in my BG&R3 that the side on which O'Bryant plays is listed as "C-5563
> 1/2", so that takes me back to the discographical end of things.
>
> Howard wrote:
>
> I think you will listen in vain for an alternative take on Roots RL317. They
> were working from tapes not 78s and simply and carelessly quoted the first
> matrix number they came to, 5347, rather than the correct 5547, or maybe it's
> just a typo, and they always really knew they were issuing 5547 (This was
> checked aurally long ago and there is a note to this effect in B&GR4)
>
>>>> >>>
>
> Thanks Howard; now I know not to look for that. Here, in summary form, is the
> data that Laird gathers for the matrix range we are discussing. At the time,
> Brunswick was also cutting sessions for a label called Majestic which was a
> product of the Grigsby-Grunow Radio Corp. Though through acquisition the
> "Majestic" name did end up used in the 1940s for a commercial label, there is
> no relationship between this one and the later one. 1929-31 Majestic was a
> personal label like Gennett's "Personal." Hardly any of these records have
> been found, but the empty stock numbers figure significantly in the 1930
> Brunswick ledger. Client work for the National Radio Advertising Co. also has
> a presence in the Brunswick book of 1930.
>
> C5312-C5349 all personal recordings, unknown (Majestic?)
> this would include C5347-C5349 credited to Bogan and dated "ca. February 1,
> 1930"; suggesting as you have that the session does not exist.
> C5350-C5352 Ben Bernie
> C5353 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson
> C5354 Charles Avery
> C5355-C5357 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson & J.[H. "Freddie"] Shayne
>
> C5540-C5546 all personal recordings, unknown (Majestic?)
> C5547-C5550 Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery
> C5551-C5552 Willie Harris
> XC5553-XC5554 Quin A. Ryan (Majestic, from dubbed masters)
> C5555-C5557 No details
> C5558-C5559 Bradley Kincaid
> C5560-C5561 Freddie "Redd" Nicholson & Charles Avery
> C5562-C5563 Lucille Bogan & Charles Avery
> C5563 1/2 Tampa Red vocal with guitar
> C5564 Tampa Red vocal with guitar & piano
> C5565-C5575 No details
> XC5576-XC5577 Quin A. Ryan (different dub of XC5553-XC5554)
> C5578-C5579 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom
>
> C6843-C6844 No details
> C6845-C6848 Lucille Bogan
> C6849-C6850 Kansas City Kitty & Georgia Tom
> C6851-C6852 No details
> C6853-C6856 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom
> C6857 No details
> C6858-C6859 Tampa Red & Georgia Tom
> C6860-C6864 No details (not used?)
> C6865-C6876 Bradley Kincaid, recorded in 1931 and not issued on Brunswick
>
> Note that O'Bryant is mentioned for C5563 1/2, whereas C5564 is shown as the
> side that has the piano. This is an error, but I note that O'Bryant's credit
> is carried only on the label copy and may not have noted in the log that Ross
> was reading.
>
> David N. Lewis
> Lebanon, OH
>
>
>
>
>

Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
howard@...
Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Arodin was not passing.

Albert Haim  produced definitive info in post 6 May 2006.

Search the forum archive with 'arodin's ancestry ' result no 11 page 2
archive no 2625.

We had long discussion Willie Joseph 2009.



Dave

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/31/patty-andrews-sisters-dies
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/31/patty-andrews-sisters-dies>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks for pointing me towards Whiskey Selling Woman. I have enjoyed Lucille
Bogan's records for many years without coming across this one. How strange given
its quality that it doesn't appear on many compilations of her work (or other
compilations for that matter). The phrase (Bob's I think) that meant I HAD to
seek it out was this one: "Each verse is treated like a variation on its own,
with an evolutionary sense of brilliance throughout." Well put! It made me think
of the really accomplished accompanists - Blind Blake's guitar backing to his
own Police Dog Blues, for instance, where each instrumental break between his
singing is unique. But it also made me go to my LP collection to find a track I
had had similar thoughts about when I first heard it many years ago: Irene's
Bakershop Blues by Wiley and Wiley [Irene and Arnold]. Arnold Wiley does
similarly inventive things as he accompanies each verse with a new variation.
Thanks, RedHotJazz.
Phil Warrington

Hello,

I'd like to contact Mike Meddings.

If you have his email, please send it off-list.

Cheers,

Andrew

For new every chorus in a blues/ barrelhouse accompaniment
try Robert McCoy accompanying "Peanut the Kidnapper" c. 1937.

I don't have the details to hand, but the accompaniment is startling
resourceful.

I have seen reviews in which Delmark's CD of McCoy material was mis-described as
a combination of the two LPs recorded by the enthusiast Pat Cather in the 1960s,
when he had found McCoy.
Actually it's only the first of the LPs, with additional material from even
later. Wonderful performer, of an Alabama piano school between Jabo Williams and
Walter Roland, whose style he echoes on another pre-war recording.  His recorded
connection with Ms. Bogan, who achieved a startling stridency by singing
fractionally off the note, seems to have been confined to playing piano on sides
by a band under her name.

Alas no return for Charles Avery!

Robert R. Calder

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbSxOT1R5qs&list=UU8Xj_3Djn97bzsjGwKyOBqw&index=1\
    (Music starts at 1:22)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ6smCv03i0    (Original recording from 1928)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgbdz_PTkoU    (Another "take" so that u can
appreciate the greatness of this band and how well they re-create the jazz scene
of NO 1928).

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I Love this really nice an historically correct Band. Incidentally I'm a
banjoist and I here appreciate the Spat's job so much.Marco




























http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbSxOT1R5qs&list=UU8Xj_3Djn97bzsjGwKyOBqw&\
;index=1    (Music starts at 1:22)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ6smCv03i0    (Original recording from 1928)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgbdz_PTkoU    (Another "take" so that u can
appreciate the greatness of this band and how well they re-create the jazz scene
of NO 1928).



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]















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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Listened again to all the McQuaid Half Way House recordings. Really refreshing
and wonderful playing. It is as if a veil was lifted off the old originals.
Extremely enjoyable! Jazz lives.....




________________________________
  From: "levi.marco@..." <levi.marco@...>
To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2013 5:39 AM
Subject: R: [RedHotJazz] Just Pretending New Orleans 1928


 

I Love this really nice an historically correct Band. Incidentally I'm a
banjoist and I here appreciate the Spat's job so much.Marco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbSxOT1R5qs&list=UU8Xj_3Djn97bzsjGwKyOBqw&\
;index=1    (Music starts at 1:22)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ6smCv03i0    (Original recording from 1928)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgbdz_PTkoU    (Another "take" so that u can
appreciate the greatness of this band and how well they re-create the jazz scene
of NO 1928).

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dear All

Looking for some information on Dawkin's Famous Coloured Jazz Band. Were they
American?

I have found an advert on 14 March 1919 that they were playing jazz "for the
first time in Scotland" on 24 March and they were "direct from London." This, of
course, is around the same time as the Original Dixieland Jazz Band arrived in
Britain.

It's in connection with a book I am writing on Verve Records. Trust me there's a
connection. . .

Thanks

Richard

Hi Richard,
If the spelling you're using is correct, then that might give a clue.
 "Coloured" is the Britsih spelling.  An American band would have used
"colored".
Mike Amato

Bedford Banjo Shop

114 S. Juliana Street

Bedford, PA  15522

(814) 623-2187

http://www.bedfordbanjoshop.com

--- On Sat, 3/2/13, Richard Havers <rhavers1@...> wrote:

From: Richard Havers <rhavers1@...>
Subject: [RedHotJazz] Dawkin's Famous Coloured Jazz Band
To: "red hot jazz" <RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Saturday, March 2, 2013, 9:12 AM
















 









       Dear All



Looking for some information on Dawkin's Famous Coloured Jazz Band. Were they
American?



I have found an advert on 14 March 1919 that they were playing jazz "for the
first time in Scotland" on 24 March and they were "direct from London." This, of
course, is around the same time as the Original Dixieland Jazz Band arrived in
Britain.



It's in connection with a book I am writing on Verve Records. Trust me there's a
connection. . .



Thanks



Richard



























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Mike

Thanks for coming back. The advert was in The Scotsman newspaper so I think they
possibly altered the spelling to be the British way even if Dawkins and Co came
from America. I have trawled everywhere and can find nothing about them.

Cheers

Richard

On 2 Mar 2013, at 16:35, Mike Amato <vintagetenor@...> wrote:

> Hi Richard,
> If the spelling you're using is correct, then that might give a clue. 
"Coloured" is the Britsih spelling.  An American band would have used "colored".
> Mike Amato
>
> Bedford Banjo Shop
>
> 114 S. Juliana Street
>
> Bedford, PA 15522
>
> (814) 623-2187
>
> http://www.bedfordbanjoshop.com
>
> --- On Sat, 3/2/13, Richard Havers rhavers1@...> wrote:
>
> From: Richard Havers rhavers1@...>
> Subject: [RedHotJazz] Dawkin's Famous Coloured Jazz Band
> To: "red hot jazz" RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Saturday, March 2, 2013, 9:12 AM
>
>
>
> Dear All
>
> Looking for some information on Dawkin's Famous Coloured Jazz Band. Were they
American?
>
> I have found an advert on 14 March 1919 that they were playing jazz "for the
first time in Scotland" on 24 March and they were "direct from London." This, of
course, is around the same time as the Original Dixieland Jazz Band arrived in
Britain.
>
> It's in connection with a book I am writing on Verve Records. Trust me there's
a connection. . .
>
> Thanks
>
> Richard
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]