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#4426 From: "Marie Clay" <marieclay@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 5:44 am
Subject: Re: SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - questions. marieclay1
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Please keep in mind that I am new at flute making, but if you sand down the nest of the flute, I think that will make your flu smaller.

Walk with God
Marie

----- Original Message -----

From: dale thomas

To: basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 7:33 AM

Subject: Re: [basic_naf_making] SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - questions.

Hi Keith, Several months back I made a very few small bore flutes. On one that I particularly enjoy playing, measures7/8" from the cutting edge of the TSH to the center of the top hole. The sides of my fingers touch while playing, but that causes no great problems yet. The flute plays well, blows easily and has a nice mellow tone, albeit, slightly airy because of the slightly too deep flue. Other than that, the flute plays nicely and none of the tone holes are hard to get a nice note from. It's been a while since I played the flute much, so I can't give you any info about how the cross fingering plays out. The sound chamber bore was cleaned (node dams) with a 1/2" twist drill from foot to plug. The SAC wasn't drilled clean (which may also contribute to airyness) and the node dam at the mouthpiece end is drilled with about a 1/4" hole. I'm including approximate measurements from the foot end. first hole center 1-9/16" 2nd hole center 2-3/16" 3rd hole center 2-7/8" cane node 3-1/8" 4th hole center 3-1/2" 5th hole center 4" 6th hole center 4-9/16" TSH South edge 5-9/16" cane node 6-1/4" SAC exit center 6-5/8" cane node 9" at mouthpiece Finger holes are 5/16" and smaller in diameter, about equally spaced, but not equal diameters. The wall thickness is about 1/8". I hope this helps, dale t. Keith Stanford <eenncar@...> wrote: Howdy folks, Some of us have been discussing making Small Bore Diameter flutes. (1/2 inch) If we use the 18:1 (Bore Length to Bore Diameter) ratio, that would give us a Bore Length of 9 inches. Using the "knuckle method" of finger-hole placement and placing the Finger-holes 1 inch apart would result in the #6 top (North) finger- hole being about 1-1/2 inch from the TSH. Will having that finger-hole that close to the TSH cause any problems? ki-e-ta

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#4425 From: "Marie Clay" <marieclay@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 5:40 am
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax marieclay1
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Speaking of flutes, I know that when you under cut, the hole when you are tuning, if you want to go higher you undercut one way, and lower you undercut another way. But I can not remember what way is for higher or lower. Can some one tell me?

Walk with God
Marie

----- Original Message -----

From: Walt G

To: basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 2:21 AM

Subject: [basic_naf_making] Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax

HI All What you all say we get back to talkin about flutes and not language lessons, dont want to be a stick in the mud but as a co-mod here it is my job to be that way sometimes. i gave permision once for off topic post and that did not turn out so well. so if ya'all can get back on trax that would be great . Thanks Walt Graywolf

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#4424 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 5:36 am
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax dalet1111
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Hi Bob,

Congrats on the new Icom.

I know what ya mean about operating time.

I haven't had a QSO since long b4 I got my new vanity NK5i call.

I think my ticket is about to expire. I need to look that up soon.

Direction holes signify the 4 compass directions and I think traditionalists add them for sending the music of the flute to all 4 directions of the globe. We may get other, welcome, comments and updates about the reason for the direction holes because traditions were different with different tribes and/or traditions change with time, as I recall reading.

They do allow the flute to be made longer too. That can enhance the aesthetics of the flute, add to its value/cost, and give more room for decorations. And, as you said, if there's some reason you can't cut the flute, or just don't want to cut the flute to length for the fundamental you can burn in the direction holes.

When I added them to my flutes I used NAFlutomat to find the right measurement and I can't recall that the application ever led me wrong for the locations. I made some flutes rediculously long for the key they were tuned to and the flutomat still gave locations that worked well. I suspect there's a length that those flutes could be shortened to and not affect the tuning of the fundamental, but I haven't a clue as to what that length is.

I don't know a way other than flutomat to find the right location for direction holes on a regular flute. I haven't noticed an option on flutomat to give direction hole locations for a walking stick flute. It has been a while since I used the application, and a while since I actually made a new flute. Lately all I've done is make some refinements to some of my old flutes.

When using flutomat be sure to change the number of holes, on the application, if you want a number other than the default 4 holes. You'll need to be careful too, to press the CALCULATE button and be sure the option for direction holes has been picked. I don't think it will work to just make the holes where the flute would be cut off for the fundamental.

Maybe someone else has a more comprehensive suggestion and a way to find direction hole locations without using flutomat.

If you're working on a particular flute you want direction holes in and give me the length you have, the note the flute sounds now and the note you want the flute to play on its fundamental when it has the direction holes in it I'll go to flutomat and punch in the figures and get back to you on the locations.

later dude,

dale t.

Bob Egner <kentukee2@...> wrote:

Hey Dale. How goes it today? Good news I just got me a new ham rig a Icom 706MK11G covers HF 6m 2m 70cm all modes. now if I can find the time to use it.... What I was going to ask you what is the reason for the 4 wind holes at the north end of the flute ? is that just for the apperance leaving it longer. Where do you start the holes is it at the cut off point at the end of the bore ie a 131/2 inch for a 3/4 inch bore because you wouldn't be able to trim off the wood that you need to to get the right fundamental note. Take care guy. Bob Runningbear yo-nv- a-di-si_____ _____________********_________________ Children are hereiditary If your Mother and Dad never had any Chances are you won't have any either. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4422 From: "Chris" <zotcaneese@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 3:00 am
Subject: Re: flute volume zotcaneese
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Hey Kev,

The width of the TSH and depth of flue do the trick most of the time.
My flutes are loud. What is loud to me? When I can play them in a
small room and it really does hurt my ears. I make lower flutes
too.... I do, however, have fairly sensetive ears but still, they are
loud. Some folks have figured out how to make a quieter but still
clean sounding flute. I haven't figured it out yet though. Remember
about recordings.... There is a LOT of amplification on some flutes
AND there is a way for them to take the "wind" out of some flutes. I
guess some folks like a "windy" flute. I don't know many that do so
the studio has some kind of trick that they use to almost eliminate
that. I can hear it instantly (sensetive ears) It sounds muddy to
me... Oh well, I'm rambeling..... If you do change these features, DO
NOT drill playing holes until you are finished or disaster will
happen. The tuning will get goofed up badly. Just get the TSH the way
you want it and then tune your fundamental..... Then do the holes. :-
) Hope this helped,

Chris

--- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, "created2heal"
<created2heal@...> wrote:
>
> howdy folks!
> just wondering, is there any way to adjust the volume on a flute
before
> I glue it up?  Also, just how loud are these beauties supposed to
be?
> I know I get lots of volume when I'm playing a CD, but are they a
> relatively quiet instrument?  I guess I'm used to the volume of
say, a
> concert side blown metal flute.  I clamped up my first flute here,
just
> to see what happened and I get a real nice tone, but very little
volume
> to my thinking.  I carved this one by hand, just to say I did, but
the
> spec's are all from Ki-e-ta's manual and so I think I got
everything
> where it should be.  The only possible "issue" might be that the
north
> end of the bore and south end of the SAC aren't rounded like they
would
> be with a router, but are more angular/ramped.  I do have all the
edges
> smoothed over though.
> Any thought?
> Namaste,
> Kev
>

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#4421 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 2:58 am
Subject: Re: flute volume dalet1111
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Hi Kev,

I haven't learned how to play a cd yet which side do you blow into? ha :-)

On flute volume, I had a hard time at first getting the volume up to where I wanted it. Mainly the things I learned were to make the width of the flue about 1/2 the diameter of the bore or a bit wider. If you go a bit wider you'll need to make the flue a little shallower than normal to keep the note from being airy sounding. If the flue is already 1/2 the bore width, be sure to get the depth of the flue about 1/32 inch. After that, make the finger holes big enough to get the volume up.

I learned within the last few days that 5/16 inch is a good diameter for the finger holes. I have been getting mine a little over 1/4 inch for a long time and was satisfied with the volume. If you need to make the finger holes bigger to get the volume up, move the hole position a little bit closer to the foot end before making the hole. That way the tuning and finger hole diameter will work together for you.

Another thing that has an affect on volume is if the TSH cutting edge or the angle is too blunt or a little too thick or if the TSH is too short. I worked on a quiet and airy sounding flute today. Mainly I cleaned all the airway passages and dressed up the side edges of the TSH and filed the underside of the TSH to make the edge straighter, thinner and sharper. Don't forget to dress up the edges of the TSH so they are at 90 degree angles to the floor of the flue. If you make the cutting edge too sharp the sound can become buzzy.

Make sure the SAC exit hole is big enough to supply enough air to give you the volume you want.

It's harder for me to answer quantatively about how loud a flute should be. Comparatively, all other things being ideal and equal, smaller flutes in higher keys will be louder than larger flutes in lower keys.

About a month ago I made a small flute that sounded good, but the volume was pretty low. I enjoyed having it that way because I wanted to play it while everyone else in the house was sleeping. The back pressure of that flute was so high that it was more difficult to play than my louder flutes. I should say that the flute was harder because it was nearly suffocating me because I couldn't breath OUT soon enough to get a convenient IN breath. I experimented with making the flue deeper and the volume came way up and breathing got a lot easier. Now I can't play it at night because its too loud. There are times when I play that flute now that I nearly want to put in ear plugs.

If you already have the flute sounding with the quality and tone you like make small changes in the areas mentioned above. I've seen that half a dozen strokes with a diamond file in the floor of the flue can make a noticeable difference in the volume. Be careful there because too deep a flue can make an airy sounding note.

The TSH being too short can make volume too low too. I've had flutes that would "play" with a 1/8 inch TSH opening. I would file a little at the time while trying the flute in between changes. If you do that carefully you'll notice you reach a certain length where very small changes in TSH length make a very noticeable difference in flute volume. As with the flue depth use extreme care while lengthening the TSH length beyond 7/32".

I hope that wsn't too much information Kev.

Good luck,

dale t.

created2heal <created2heal@...> wrote:

howdy folks! just wondering, is there any way to adjust the volume on a flute before I glue it up? Also, just how loud are these beauties supposed to be? I know I get lots of volume when I'm playing a CD, but are they a relatively quiet instrument? I guess I'm used to the volume of say, a concert side blown metal flute. I clamped up my first flute here, just to see what happened and I get a real nice tone, but very little volume to my thinking. I carved this one by hand, just to say I did, but the spec's are all from Ki-e-ta's manual and so I think I got everything where it should be. The only possible "issue" might be that the north end of the bore and south end of the SAC aren't rounded like they would be with a router, but are more angular/ramped. I do have all the edges smoothed over though. Any thought? Namaste, Kev

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#4420 From: Kevin Christensen <created2heal@...>
Date: Sat Apr 1, 2006 1:05 am
Subject: Re: flute volume created2heal
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Hey Bob,

I started with a 3/4 bore and so the flue is 3/8. After bore sanding, it's running closer to 7/8. But I got tone on this gem before bore sanding. I could widen the flue, but being as I had the problem before, I'm not sure it would help. It is still in the square, so maybe rounding and thinning will help. I just wanted some input in case there was something I needed to do before I glue her up. I'm kinda amped up, this being my maiden voyage.

Thanks,

Kev

Bob Egner <kentukee2@...> wrote:

Hey Kev. What size is your bore? There are two ways thai I know of that will increase your volume one is to have a thin wall on your bore the other is to widen your flue thats why I ask what size your bore is If you are going by the Ki-E-Ta manual then you should have ever thing right he has the best book out there that I have saw anyway. I use it all the time and all my flutes have been just great. There may be some other ways to increase the volume but this is the only two that I know I just bet some one else will know more about this than I do. Take care. Bob Runningbear yo-nv- a-di-si_____ _____________********_________________ Children are hereiditary If your Mother and Dad never had any Chances are you won't have any either. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

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#4419 From: "Chris" <zotcaneese@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 11:44 pm
Subject: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax zotcaneese
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Gee Walt,

My apologies! It won't happen again. I'll quit from now on. Only
flutes, no jokes.... Roger that roger,

Chris

--- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, "Walt G" <manofsorrow66@...>
wrote:
>
> HI All
> What you all say we get back to talkin about flutes and not
language
> lessons, dont want to be a stick in the mud but as a co-mod here it
is my
> job to be that way sometimes. i gave permision once for off topic
post and
> that did not turn out so well. so if ya'all can get back on trax
that would
> be great .
> Thanks Walt Graywolf
>

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#4418 From: Bob Egner <kentukee2@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 11:07 pm
Subject: Re: flute volume kentukee2
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Hey Kev.
What size is your bore? There are two ways thai I know
of that will increase your volume one is to have a
thin wall on your bore the other is to widen your flue
thats why I ask what size your bore is If you are
going by the Ki-E-Ta manual then you should have ever
thing right he has the best book out there that I have
saw anyway.
I use it all the time and all my flutes have been just
great. There may be some other ways to increase the
volume but this is the only two that I know I just bet
some one else will know more about this than I do.
Take care.
Bob Runningbear


yo-nv- a-di-si_____

   _____________********_________________

   Children are hereiditary
   If your Mother and Dad never had any
   Chances are you won't have any either.



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4417 From: "created2heal" <created2heal@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 8:13 pm
Subject: flute volume created2heal
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howdy folks!
just wondering, is there any way to adjust the volume on a flute before
I glue it up?  Also, just how loud are these beauties supposed to be?
I know I get lots of volume when I'm playing a CD, but are they a
relatively quiet instrument?  I guess I'm used to the volume of say, a
concert side blown metal flute.  I clamped up my first flute here, just
to see what happened and I get a real nice tone, but very little volume
to my thinking.  I carved this one by hand, just to say I did, but the
spec's are all from Ki-e-ta's manual and so I think I got everything
where it should be.  The only possible "issue" might be that the north
end of the bore and south end of the SAC aren't rounded like they would
be with a router, but are more angular/ramped.  I do have all the edges
smoothed over though.
Any thought?
Namaste,
Kev

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#4416 From: Larry Evans <larry@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:21 pm
Subject: Re: SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - questions. mockingbirdf...
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On 3/31/06 8:56 AM, "Keith Stanford" <eenncar@...> wrote:

Hi Keith,
That is the problem with the knuckle method, you really need to adjust it once you get away from the 7/8 bore flutes and then if your like me it still doesn’t work all that well. You need for an 1/2 inch bore to find a seven year old kid and use their knuckles. LOL I just did a high E from a 1/2 inch bore and it turned out fine although I could have moved the bottom hole a little further south so the upper holes wouldn’t be so close together. That seven year old could easily play it but it is a little tight for me. My rule of thumb is that the top hole has to be further away from the tsh than hole one is from the foot. I did a quick check on naflutomat and came up with a small hole of .123 at hole six and it was at about 2 3/4 so my guess is that yes you would end up having problems with the top hole only 1 1/2 inches from the tsh. For one thing it would be very small like a pin hole plus it may not play at all.
Just my two cents worth,
Larry

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#4415 From: Bob Egner <kentukee2@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:56 pm
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax kentukee2
Offline
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Hey Dale.
How goes it today? Good news I just got me a new ham
rig a Icom 706MK11G covers HF 6m 2m 70cm all modes.
now if I can find the time to use it.... What I was
going to ask you what is the reason for the 4 wind
holes at the north end of the flute ? is that just for
the apperance leaving it longer. Where do you start
the holes is it at the cut off point at the end of the
bore ie a 131/2 inch for a 3/4 inch bore because you
wouldn't be able to trim off the wood that you need to
to get the right fundamental note. Take care guy.
Bob Runningbear


yo-nv- a-di-si_____

   _____________********_________________

   Children are hereiditary
   If your Mother and Dad never had any
   Chances are you won't have any either.



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4414 From: "Keith Stanford" <eenncar@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:47 pm
Subject: Re: SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - finger-hole diameters kieta13
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Perect Dale, THANX!

I'd also like to get your thoughts (and anyone else's) on the Finger-
hole diameters.  On your flute, they are 5/16" and smaller.

If we want larger Finger-holes, we can move them down (South - toward
the open end of the Flute).  Will that cause any problems?

Thanks again Dale, for your continuing particiaption.

ki-e-ta




---------------------------------
I
n basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, dale thomas <dalet1111@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Keith,
>
>   Several months back I made a very few small bore flutes.
>   On one that I particularly enjoy playing, measures7/8"  from the
cutting edge of the TSH to the center of the top hole.
>
>   The sides of my fingers touch while playing, but that causes no
great problems yet.  The flute plays well, blows easily and has a
nice mellow tone, albeit, slightly airy because of the slightly too
deep flue.  Other than that, the flute plays nicely and none of the
tone holes are hard to get a nice note from.  It's been a while since
I played the flute much, so I can't give you any info about how the
cross fingering plays out.
>
>   The sound chamber bore was cleaned (node dams) with a 1/2" twist
drill from foot to plug.  The SAC wasn't drilled clean (which may
also contribute to airyness) and the node dam at the mouthpiece end
is drilled with about a 1/4" hole.
>
>   I'm including approximate measurements from the foot end.
>   first hole center 1-9/16"
>   2nd hole center 2-3/16"
>   3rd hole center 2-7/8"
>   cane node  3-1/8"
>   4th hole center 3-1/2"
>   5th hole center 4"
>   6th hole center 4-9/16"
>   TSH South edge 5-9/16"
>   cane node 6-1/4"
>   SAC exit center 6-5/8"
>   cane node 9" at mouthpiece
>   Finger holes are 5/16" and smaller in diameter, about equally
spaced, but not equal diameters.
>   The wall thickness is about 1/8".
>
>   I hope this helps,
>   dale t.
>
>
>
> Keith Stanford <eenncar@...> wrote:
>   Howdy folks,
>
> Some of us have been discussing making Small Bore Diameter flutes.
(1/2
> inch)
>
> If we use the 18:1 (Bore Length to Bore Diameter) ratio, that would
> give us a Bore Length of 9 inches.
>
> Using the "knuckle method" of finger-hole placement and placing the
> Finger-holes 1 inch apart would result in the #6 top (North) finger-
> hole being about 1-1/2 inch from the TSH.
>
> Will having that finger-hole that close to the TSH cause any
problems?
>
> ki-e-ta
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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>
>
>     Visit your group "basic_naf_making" on the web.
>
>     To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
>     Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>

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#4413 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:33 pm
Subject: Re: SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - questions. dalet1111
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Hi Keith,

Several months back I made a very few small bore flutes.

On one that I particularly enjoy playing, measures7/8" from the cutting edge of the TSH to the center of the top hole.

The sides of my fingers touch while playing, but that causes no great problems yet. The flute plays well, blows easily and has a nice mellow tone, albeit, slightly airy because of the slightly too deep flue. Other than that, the flute plays nicely and none of the tone holes are hard to get a nice note from. It's been a while since I played the flute much, so I can't give you any info about how the cross fingering plays out.

The sound chamber bore was cleaned (node dams) with a 1/2" twist drill from foot to plug. The SAC wasn't drilled clean (which may also contribute to airyness) and the node dam at the mouthpiece end is drilled with about a 1/4" hole.

I'm including approximate measurements from the foot end.

first hole center 1-9/16"

2nd hole center 2-3/16"

3rd hole center 2-7/8"

cane node 3-1/8"

4th hole center 3-1/2"

5th hole center 4"

6th hole center 4-9/16"

TSH South edge 5-9/16"

cane node 6-1/4"

SAC exit center 6-5/8"

cane node 9" at mouthpiece

Finger holes are 5/16" and smaller in diameter, about equally spaced, but not equal diameters.

The wall thickness is about 1/8".

I hope this helps,

dale t.

Keith Stanford <eenncar@...> wrote:

Howdy folks, Some of us have been discussing making Small Bore Diameter flutes. (1/2 inch) If we use the 18:1 (Bore Length to Bore Diameter) ratio, that would give us a Bore Length of 9 inches. Using the "knuckle method" of finger-hole placement and placing the Finger-holes 1 inch apart would result in the #6 top (North) finger- hole being about 1-1/2 inch from the TSH. Will having that finger-hole that close to the TSH cause any problems? ki-e-ta

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#4412 From: "Keith Stanford" <eenncar@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:56 pm
Subject: SMALL BORE DIAMETER Flute - questions. kieta13
Offline
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Howdy folks,

Some of us have been discussing making Small Bore Diameter flutes. (1/2
inch)

If we use the 18:1 (Bore Length to Bore Diameter) ratio, that would
give us a Bore Length of 9 inches.

Using the "knuckle method" of finger-hole placement and placing the
Finger-holes 1 inch apart would result in the #6 top (North) finger-
hole being about 1-1/2 inch from the TSH.

Will having that finger-hole that close to the TSH cause any problems?

ki-e-ta

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#4411 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:33 pm
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax dalet1111
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Hi Walt,

I appelegize for my part in the off topic posts and for makin your job harder.

I say we pull that stick out of the mudd wash it cleaqn and break off a short piece of it for the fetish. Carve that into a mudd turtle. When I was a kid I used to see those usually they stayed in the water so long that they had thick moss on their backs. They were shaped in such a way as to be able to close their shell against invaders better than other turtles or terrapins I've seen.

The remainder of the stick can be used with limb flute procedures to make a fine NAF. We see flutes in everything.

Thanks for the reality jog. Maybe it's just the Spring season getting in the air.

:-)

have a wonderful day Walt,

dale t.

Walt G <manofsorrow66@...> wrote:

HI All What you all say we get back to talkin about flutes and not language lessons, dont want to be a stick in the mud but as a co-mod here it is my job to be that way sometimes. i gave permision once for off topic post and that did not turn out so well. so if ya'all can get back on trax that would be great . Thanks Walt Graywolf

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#4410 From: "Keith Stanford" <eenncar@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:31 pm
Subject: Re: First small bore flute kieta13
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Howdy Redbird,
A couple of questions for you:
(1) You mentioned that your flute had a 'small bore'.  How small?  (I
have been in discussion about a 1/2" Bore recently.)
(2) Tell us a little about using 'chimneys' on your Fetish-blocks.
How and why.  Lots of folks will be interested.
(3) Will we get to see the finished Flute in the PHOTOS section?

Kind regards,
ki-e-ta

------------------------------------------
In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, "Redbird" <totsuwa@...> wrote:
>
> Hey guys, just checking in.  It's been a busy few weeks for me, so
I
> haven't had time to do much flute work - at least until tonight.
>
> I had roughed in the body of a small bore about three weeks ago.
> Tonight I cut the TSH and airway, stuck a bird with a chimney on it
> (my preference for airways) and then checked the tuning.
>
> As it was within a few cents of an A, I went ahead and went for
it.  I
> now have a very sweet little A flute with one of my stylized
cardinals
> on top.  I haven't sealed it or put the finish on it yet, but this
one
> is going in my personal collection - so far I just love playing it,
> even unfinished.
>
> Hopefully, I'll have it all finished out for our next flute circle
> meeting on Monday evening so I can show it off!
>
> BTW, Windsongs NAF Circle will be meeting on Monday, April 3 at
7:30
> PM at Hopewell United Methodist Church in Level, Maryland.  Level
is
> near Havre de Grace MD, just off I-95. Everyone is welcome, whether
> you play or not.
>
> Totsuwa
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (5)

#4409 From: "Walt G" <manofsorrow66@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 10:21 am
Subject: Re: language lesson?- let get back on trax gwolf66
Offline
Send Email

HI All
What you all say we get back to talkin about flutes and not language
lessons, dont want to be a stick in the mud but as a co-mod here it is my
job to be that way sometimes. i gave permision once for off topic post and
that did not turn out so well. so if ya'all can get back on trax that would
be great .
Thanks Walt Graywolf

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (19)

#4408 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 4:47 am
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson dalet1111
Offline
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emp, pro-nounced imp is a little critter with pointy ears.

pen, is a carved writing instrument with finger holes bored into them and used by emps to play musick,

age is haw olde ye r

so empanage is an olde, pointy eared, n/a flute player-flying a model aire plain

dale t.

Chris <zotcaneese@...> wrote:

Some people's kids..... :-) I ain't even gonna try to teach a Frenchman how to spell American country lingo. Dale, what are we gonna do with you boy? ;-) So Dale, since you talked about airplane terminology, what is the exact English translation of the word "empenage"? I know what the empenage is, I want a translation of that word. Flutes-flutes-flutes-flutes...... :-) You can't say I didn't mention flutes.... heh-heh-heh Chris --- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, dale thomas <dalet1111@...> wrote: > > easier pro-nouncie-ashun of y'all is like a ship or airplane when it does that "yaw" thing, then just add the double L. ok, yawll ? > dale t. > > Chris <zotcaneese@...> wrote: > Oooh, I love it when my point gets proved!!! :-) Break it down..... > ya + ll. Make the sounds and it don't sound right. Again, the "ya" is > getting shortened to "Y" so it gets the apotstophy and "all" stands > alone Y' + all. Although you say "ya" you don't say ya + all. It > sounds more like yee + all, but "all" doesn't change, even if you say > it. Like I said before, I had a heck of a time getting it across when > I lived there..... bunch of hard-heads! :-) As for pronounciation, > OKIES and Texans say it just the same.... Texans just don't know how > to spell it right.... heh-heh-heh HOWEVER, this is NOT an Oklahoma / > Texas rivalry thing.... Get that straight right away.... I have lived > in both states and love them both. Other than the sports stuff, we > are a lot more alike than either of us want to admit. Some of the > nicest folks in the nation live in our region and I think it speaks > volumes!!!! Have a great day and do us all a favor and spell it > right. Maybe you can teach a few friends, now that you know..... heh- > heh-heh :-) :-) :-) The revolution begins! ;-) > > That crazy OKIE, > > Chris > > This note is very smart-***** in tone and meant for humor purposes. > It is NOT meant to be taken personally in any way. I say this because > some folks have such "thin-skin" these days and get offended > easily.... Whatever.... Anyway..... Y'ALL....... ;-) > > > --- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, Last Romantic > <lastromantic49@> wrote: > > > > > > On the other hand, just as a possibility, since "you" > > is pronounced "ya" around here, perhaps the letter > > that is left out is the first "a" in "all". Therefore, > > "ya'll" would be correct! Ya reckon? > > > > Or, another, just as likely explanation, my fumbly > > fingers can't keep up! Unfortunately, they play the > > flute about the same way! lol > > > > (requisite on-topic flute mention!) lol > > > > Grins. > > > > > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > The memorable things in our lives are the things we stopped making > excuses to avoid. > > Me > > > > People find life entirely too time-consuming. > > -- Stanislaw J. Lec > > > > When everyone is against you, > > it means that you are absolutely wrong-- > > or absolutely right. > > -- Albert Guinon > > > > Possum Lodge Men's Prayer > > "I'm a man > > but I can change > > if I have to > > I guess" > > -Red Green Show > > > > Red Green's Motto: > > If a woman doesn't find you handsome, she should at least find you > handy!" > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "basic_naf_making" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > basic_naf_making-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- >

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (19)

#4407 From: "Chris" <zotcaneese@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 4:30 am
Subject: Re: language lesson zotcaneese
Offline
Send Email

Some people's kids..... :-) I ain't even gonna try to teach a
Frenchman how to spell American country lingo. Dale, what are we
gonna do with you boy? ;-) So Dale, since you talked about airplane
terminology, what is the exact English translation of the
word "empenage"? I know what the empenage is, I want a translation of
that word. Flutes-flutes-flutes-flutes...... :-) You can't say I
didn't mention flutes.... heh-heh-heh

Chris

--- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
wrote:
>
> easier pro-nouncie-ashun of y'all is like a ship or airplane when
it does that "yaw" thing, then just add the double L.  ok, yawll ?
>   dale t.
>
> Chris <zotcaneese@...> wrote:
>   Oooh, I love it when my point gets proved!!! :-) Break it
down.....
> ya + ll. Make the sounds and it don't sound right. Again, the "ya"
is
> getting shortened to "Y" so it gets the apotstophy and "all" stands
> alone Y' + all. Although you say "ya" you don't say ya + all. It
> sounds more like yee + all, but "all" doesn't change, even if you
say
> it. Like I said before, I had a heck of a time getting it across
when
> I lived there..... bunch of hard-heads! :-) As for pronounciation,
> OKIES and Texans say it just the same.... Texans just don't know
how
> to spell it right.... heh-heh-heh HOWEVER, this is NOT an
Oklahoma /
> Texas rivalry thing.... Get that straight right away.... I have
lived
> in both states and love them both. Other than the sports stuff, we
> are a lot more alike than either of us want to admit. Some of the
> nicest folks in the nation live in our region and I think it speaks
> volumes!!!! Have a great day and do us all a favor and spell it
> right. Maybe you can teach a few friends, now that you know.....
heh-
> heh-heh :-) :-) :-) The revolution begins! ;-)
>
> That crazy OKIE,
>
> Chris
>
> This note is very smart-***** in tone and meant for humor purposes.
> It is NOT meant to be taken personally in any way. I say this
because
> some folks have such "thin-skin" these days and get offended
> easily.... Whatever.... Anyway..... Y'ALL....... ;-)
>
>
> --- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, Last Romantic
> <lastromantic49@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > On the other hand, just as a possibility, since "you"
> > is pronounced "ya" around here, perhaps the letter
> > that is left out is the first "a" in "all". Therefore,
> > "ya'll" would be correct! Ya reckon?
> >
> > Or, another, just as likely explanation, my fumbly
> > fingers can't keep up! Unfortunately, they play the
> > flute about the same way! lol
> >
> > (requisite on-topic flute mention!) lol
> >
> > Grins.
> >
> >
> > ++++++++++++++++++++++++
> > The memorable things in our lives are the things we stopped
making
> excuses to avoid.
> > Me
> >
> > People find life entirely too time-consuming.
> > -- Stanislaw J. Lec
> >
> > When everyone is against you,
> > it means that you are absolutely wrong--
> > or absolutely right.
> > -- Albert Guinon
> >
> > Possum Lodge Men's Prayer
> > "I'm a man
> > but I can change
> > if I have to
> > I guess"
> > -Red Green Show
> >
> > Red Green's Motto:
> > If a woman doesn't find you handsome, she should at least find
you
> handy!"
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>
>     Visit your group "basic_naf_making" on the web.
>
>     To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>  basic_naf_making-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>     Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (19)

#4406 From: dale thomas <dalet1111@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:44 am
Subject: Re: Re: language lesson dalet1111
Offline
Send Email

easier pro-nouncie-ashun of y'all is like a ship or airplane when it does that "yaw" thing, then just add the double L. ok, yawll ?

dale t.

Chris <zotcaneese@...> wrote:

Oooh, I love it when my point gets proved!!! :-) Break it down..... ya + ll. Make the sounds and it don't sound right. Again, the "ya" is getting shortened to "Y" so it gets the apotstophy and "all" stands alone Y' + all. Although you say "ya" you don't say ya + all. It sounds more like yee + all, but "all" doesn't change, even if you say it. Like I said before, I had a heck of a time getting it across when I lived there..... bunch of hard-heads! :-) As for pronounciation, OKIES and Texans say it just the same.... Texans just don't know how to spell it right.... heh-heh-heh HOWEVER, this is NOT an Oklahoma / Texas rivalry thing.... Get that straight right away.... I have lived in both states and love them both. Other than the sports stuff, we are a lot more alike than either of us want to admit. Some of the nicest folks in the nation live in our region and I think it speaks volumes!!!! Have a great day and do us all a favor and spell it right. Maybe you can teach a few friends, now that you know..... heh- heh-heh :-) :-) :-) The revolution begins! ;-) That crazy OKIE, Chris This note is very smart-***** in tone and meant for humor purposes. It is NOT meant to be taken personally in any way. I say this because some folks have such "thin-skin" these days and get offended easily.... Whatever.... Anyway..... Y'ALL....... ;-) --- In basic_naf_making@yahoogroups.com, Last Romantic <lastromantic49@...> wrote: > > > On the other hand, just as a possibility, since "you" > is pronounced "ya" around here, perhaps the letter > that is left out is the first "a" in "all". Therefore, > "ya'll" would be correct! Ya reckon? > > Or, another, just as likely explanation, my fumbly > fingers can't keep up! Unfortunately, they play the > flute about the same way! lol > > (requisite on-topic flute mention!) lol > > Grins. > > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > The memorable things in our lives are the things we stopped making excuses to avoid. > Me > > People find life entirely too time-consuming. > -- Stanislaw J. Lec > > When everyone is against you, > it means that you are absolutely wrong-- > or absolutely right. > -- Albert Guinon > > Possum Lodge Men's Prayer > "I'm a man > but I can change > if I have to > I guess" > -Red Green Show > > Red Green's Motto: > If a woman doesn't find you handsome, she should at least find you handy!" > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com >

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (19)

#4405 From: "Redbird" <totsuwa@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:39 am
Subject: First small bore flute totsuwa
Offline
Send Email

Hey guys, just checking in.  It's been a busy few weeks for me, so I
haven't had time to do much flute work - at least until tonight.

I had roughed in the body of a small bore about three weeks ago.
Tonight I cut the TSH and airway, stuck a bird with a chimney on it
(my preference for airways) and then checked the tuning.

As it was within a few cents of an A, I went ahead and went for it.  I
now have a very sweet little A flute with one of my stylized cardinals
on top.  I haven't sealed it or put the finish on it yet, but this one
is going in my personal collection - so far I just love playing it,
even unfinished.

Hopefully, I'll have it all finished out for our next flute circle
meeting on Monday evening so I can show it off!

BTW, Windsongs NAF Circle will be meeting on Monday, April 3 at 7:30
PM at Hopewell United Methodist Church in Level, Maryland.  Level is
near Havre de Grace MD, just off I-95. Everyone is welcome, whether
you play or not.

Totsuwa

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (5)

#4404 From: Gary <gajon12@...>
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2006 1:05 am
Subject: Re: Bore Question gajon12
Offline
Send Email

ok will do. may be a couple days. gotta make the fetish yet. its the bore that goes diagonal. i was able to make the outside round. actually i think i know what happened. the routing wasn't exactly centered. i'm using a cheaper model plunge router too. i have to rig up a better system than what i have been doing i think.

Bob Egner <kentukee2@...> wrote:

Hey Gary. If if plays good and sounds good...well there you go.. hey maybe you have something going there a slanted bore. You have something that no one else has. It had to be the way you sanded it or which ever way you worked the wood down, But hey it works for you and thats the main thing right now. When you get the finish on post a photo on the home page ok? Keep the chips flying bud. Bob Runningbear yo-nv- a-di-si_____ _____________********_________________ Children are hereiditary If your Mother and Dad never had any Chances are you won't have any either. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4403 From: Bob Egner <kentukee2@...>
Date: Thu Mar 30, 2006 4:55 pm
Subject: Re: Bore Question kentukee2
Offline
Send Email

Hey Gary.
If if plays good and sounds good...well there you go..
hey maybe you have something going there a slanted
bore. You have something that no one else has. It had
to be the way you sanded it or which  ever way you
worked the wood down, But hey it works for you and
thats the main thing right now. When you get the
finish on post a photo on the home page ok? Keep the
chips flying bud.
Bob Runningbear


yo-nv- a-di-si_____

   _____________********_________________

   Children are hereiditary
   If your Mother and Dad never had any
   Chances are you won't have any either.



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4402 From: Gary <gajon12@...>
Date: Thu Mar 30, 2006 12:46 pm
Subject: Re: Bore Question gajon12
Offline
Send Email

Hey Bob, The flute tuned up just fine. Another thing about this thing........the bore is slanted! How that happened I don't know, but it plays ok...so far....have to put the finish on.

Gary

Bob Egner <kentukee2@...> wrote:

Hi Gary. We talked about your problem a short time ago. Hope you got it worked out. You will know when you start to tune it. Im sure it will be ok Let me know how it turnes out ok? If I can help you in any way let me know. Take care. Bob Runningbear yo-nv- a-di-si_____ _____________********_________________ Children are hereiditary If your Mother and Dad never had any Chances are you won't have any either. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4401 From: Gary <gajon12@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 4:06 pm
Subject: Re: Re: the old flue question gajon12
Offline
Send Email

Dang, that flute will always have a "cent"!

Last Romantic <lastromantic49@...> wrote:

When building a flute with the flue in the body, is distance a factor, from the TSH to the SAC hole? I had started one of yellow cedar, using the split, groove, drill from both ends routine (3/4" dia bore). I had left only a very thin wall. In finishing, I decided to try the body flue method, but was unable to get any sound at all. I filled the flue with beeswax, and used my usual bird-flue, and it sounded fine. I am wondering if maybe the distance was too short, or else the cutting edge in the TSH was too high. I know, I know, the body-bird flue distinction goes with plains or woodland style, but without the old messages available, I can't recall which is which, forgive me. I did run into an oops situation on this flute as well, which I don't think has a bearing on the other question, well, maybe. I had messed up my drilling from both ends bit and left a much thinner wall than I thought. In sanding the bore, I discovered the wall was almost nonexistent. As I had already made the SAC and TSH holes, I slid a dowel into the SAC hole as a stop. I discovered that a penny was a snug sliding fit, put tape on a 5/8 dowel to keep the penny straight, slid it down to where the wall should be, and glued it into place. Seems to do the job. At least I know this flute will be worth good money! walk in peace Bill ++++++++++++++++++++++++ The memorable things in our lives are the things we stopped making excuses to avoid. Me Times have not become more violent. They have just become more televised. -- Marilyn Manson Organized crime in America takes in over forty billion dollars a year and spends very little on office supplies. -- Woody Allen __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (2)

#4400 From: Last Romantic <lastromantic49@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:59 pm
Subject: Re: the old flue question lastromantic49
Offline
Send Email

When building a flute with the flue in the body, is
distance a factor, from the TSH to the SAC hole? I had
started one of yellow cedar, using the split, groove,
drill from both ends routine (3/4" dia bore). I had
left only a very thin wall. In finishing, I decided to
try the body flue method, but was unable to get any
sound at all. I filled the flue with beeswax, and used
my usual bird-flue, and it sounded fine. I am
wondering if maybe the distance was too short, or else
the cutting edge in the TSH was too high.

I know, I know, the body-bird flue distinction goes
with plains or woodland style, but without the old
messages available, I can't recall which is which,
forgive me.

I did run into an oops situation on this flute as
well, which I don't think has a bearing on the other
question, well, maybe. I had messed up my drilling
from both ends bit and left a much thinner wall than I
thought. In sanding the bore, I discovered the wall
was almost nonexistent. As I had already made the SAC
and TSH holes, I slid a dowel into the SAC hole as a
stop. I discovered that a penny was a snug sliding
fit, put tape on a 5/8 dowel to keep the penny
straight, slid it down to where the wall should be,
and glued it into place. Seems to do the job. At least
I know this flute will be worth good money!

walk in peace
Bill


++++++++++++++++++++++++
The memorable things in our lives are the things we stopped making excuses to
avoid.
Me

Times have not become more violent.
They have just become more televised.
-- Marilyn Manson

Organized crime in America takes in over forty billion
dollars a year and spends very little on office supplies.
-- Woody Allen

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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#4399 From: "created2heal" <created2heal@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:26 pm
Subject: photo posts created2heal
Offline
Send Email

Hey everyone!
Just an observation and a request.  When I look at the photo section,
which I do constantly, I find myself wishing that I could get a closer
look at some of these works of art.  There are a few close-ups of the
birds, but only rarely can I get a really good look at the detail on
the flutes themselves.  Some of the websites "out there" give me a full
screen view of their flutes which I find very helpful, but most of the
shots in this forum are from a distance with an artistic background.
So I guess my request is that all of you retake your flute shots and
enlarge them so I can enjoy and learn at the same time.
Should only take you a minute or too. :-DDD
ROFL
Seriously though, in the future, is it possible to get closer shots, or
is it not an option?

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (1)

#4398 From: Gary <gajon12@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:15 pm
Subject: Re: Bore Question gajon12
Offline
Send Email

Ok Bob, Thanks again.

Gary

Bob Egner <kentukee2@...> wrote:

Hi Gary. We talked about your problem a short time ago. Hope you got it worked out. You will know when you start to tune it. Im sure it will be ok Let me know how it turnes out ok? If I can help you in any way let me know. Take care. Bob Runningbear yo-nv- a-di-si_____ _____________********_________________ Children are hereiditary If your Mother and Dad never had any Chances are you won't have any either. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (8)

#4397 From: Bob Egner <kentukee2@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 4:32 am
Subject: Re: Bore Question kentukee2
Offline
Send Email

Hi Gary.
We talked about your problem a short time ago. Hope
you got it worked out. You will know when you start to
tune it. Im sure it will be ok Let me know how it
turnes out ok? If I can help you in any way let me
know. Take care.
Bob Runningbear

yo-nv- a-di-si_____

   _____________********_________________

   Children are hereiditary
   If your Mother and Dad never had any
   Chances are you won't have any either.



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (8)

#4396 From: "Keith Stanford" <eenncar@...>
Date: Wed Mar 29, 2006 1:50 am
Subject: Where did the messages go? kieta13
Offline
Send Email

I am checking to see why Yahoo hid our messages.

Check back soon......................

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