From: dracpac2001 <dracpac2001@...>
Subject: [sumerland] Re: Watchers/Aliens
To: sumerland@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, July 16, 2009, 12:34 PM

 

Hi

Thats exactly what Graham Hancock argues in his book "Supernatural: Meetings with the Ancient Teachers of Mankind"

http://www.play. com/Books/ Books/4-/ 1097398/Supernat ural/Product. html

I thought it was quite an interesting read

Dave

--- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com, "kaoscrow@.. ." <kaoscrow@.. .> wrote:
>
> Yeah, I could see that. One thing I find fascinating is just how similar "alien" experiences are to the sort of experiences that in the past were put down to Faery encounters. (Or for that matter Angelic)So much so that I think they are basically the same encounters. The "alien" ones are just interpreted through our modern techno cultural expectations and influences as oposed to a more arcadian pre industrial conditioning.
> The entities/thought forms encountered are the same.
> Now, if we are talking interdimensional or inter time aliens then yes you could see them as aliens to our dimesion or time.
> Also, just because i don't necessarily go along with the space "alien" thing I would still never dismiss it and, indeed, wouldn't be overly surprised were it to be the case.
>
> KaosCrow
> xxx
>
>
>
>
> --- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com, Keen Venables <kvenables@> wrote:
> >
> > Maybe you are looking at it the wrong way around - maybe the Watchers aren't aliens, but the so-called aliens are Watchers!
> >
> > Keen
> >
> > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > From: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com] On Behalf Of Dragon
> > Sent: 14 July 2009 12:08 AM
> > To: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com
> > Subject: Re: [sumerland] Re: Introduction as requested and Sons
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Like you, I'm not into the Watchers as aliens stuff. I am prone to see them in the same light as "daimons", "genii" (geniuses), tutelary spirits/guides and djinn. This was the original idea, from back in the Neolithic: they were the genius or spirit of a class of things or creatures; a place (like a well, cave, spring); or each individual thing in Creation. They have a greater resonance with me than a lot of other entities - especially aliens. Some spastic switch in my brain goes off everytime I see "Watchers" and "aliens" mentioned in one sentence. Zttttt! Zttttt. I'm trying to control it. I know it is contrary to Mr. McCoy's view of things, but I can't help it.
> >
> > Later, it was believed that each of us was given this "guiding spirit or intelligence" just before we were born into this world. It's very similar to the "divine spark" of the Gnostics. They are not something solely outside of us, but within us as well. The thing the shaman could do was "converse" with the spirits of plants, animals, the heavens, the underworld and the ancestors. But these "conversations didn't take place "here". They took place over to the other side. Everything and everyone has a soul or spirit. The shaman divined what the nature of that spirit was and came to know it. This is the same things the Watchers did, to learn their knowledge. Observation and timing are both essential to success in workings, as P.J. Carroll points out in Liber KAOS. Another reason why I like to use the Watchers: they are watchers - those who observe: a couple of them keep time, as well - Sariel and Shamshiel.
> > They work well for me.
> >
> > Another "empty handed" chaote :) Right on. I believe that 'magic' or 'magick' (whichever you prefer) is a 24/7 thing in a way. One should BE magical, not practice (at) it. I think if you are in touch with your guiding spirit, it puts you more in tune with "out there". The empty handed way fits the bill, perfectly. Besides, your will, imagination and visualization skills are the ONLY limit to what you can do there. I applaude you, KaosCrow.
> >
> > R.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Mon, 7/13/09, kaoscrow@ <kaoscrow@> wrote:
> >
> > From: kaoscrow@ <kaoscrow@>
> > Subject: [sumerland] Re: Introduction as requested and Sons
> > To: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com
> > Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 12:46 PM
> >
> > I would most definitely recomend them then. Well worth taking the time out for and they're not that long.
> > Don't work too hard! You have to have fun and play!
> > As for working with gods or sigils... Well, both and other stuff too. But not that often. Mostly empty handed stuff now really.
> > I'm kind of of the opinion that you should get to a point where you don't have to DO magic as such but that stuff should just go your way without intervention. Occasionally things need a nudge here and there though but I guess living in a stone circle helps things along nicely!
> >
> > KaosCrow
> > xxx
> >
> > --- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>, Keen Venables <kvenables@ ..> wrote:
> > >
> > > Actually, I haven't read them. I haven't read a book in a couple of years (never thought I would say that), most of my time being taken up with reading news articles (international politics is a hobby of mine and this has been a busy time) and my work!
> > >
> > > Do you work with gods or do you sigilise?
> > >
> > > Keen
> > >
> > > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > >
> > > From: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com> [mailto:sumerland@ yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>] On Behalf Of kaoscrow@
> > > Sent: 13 July 2009 02:23 PM
> > > To: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>
> > > Subject: [sumerland] Re: Introduction as requested and Sons
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Keen,
> > > No I haven't read those books. They sound interesting as fiction, though I must admit I do turn off a bit when it comes to aliens and watchers.
> > > I guess you've probably read the Storm Constantine Grigori trilogy? I thought that was a particularly good fictional account of the watchers.
> > > And Hoorah, all Hail Chaos, fellow Chaote!
> > >
> > > KaosCrow
> > > xxx
> > >
> > > --- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>, Keen Venables <kvenables@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi KaosCrow. Ever read the Many Coloured Land Trilogy of science fiction books by Julian May? She suggests that the angels and demons of our mythology (as well as most other mythologies of creatures both beautiful and ugly and more than human) are based on aliens that lived in our world during the Pleistocene (sp?) era. Very interesting series of books, perhaps not entirely on subject, but still well worth reading.
> > > >
> > > > By the way, I'm also a chaote.
> > > >
> > > > Keen
> > > >
> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > > > From: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com> [mailto:sumerland@ yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>] On Behalf Of kaoscrow@
> > > > Sent: 10 July 2009 06:52 PM
> > > > To: sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>
> > > > Subject: [sumerland] Re: Introduction as requested and Sons
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Excellent, I love a good can of worms, being a crow an' all!
> > > >
> > > > I think it all depends on whether you view the Watchers/Fallen Angels/Angels as being some kind of ethereal spirit type creature as would be the common perception of Angels or as a separate and distinct sub class of physical (human)being.
> > > > The latter would be more along the lines of Andy Collin's theory and personally the one I would subscribe to. That is not to say that they didn't possess extraordinary abilities that would make them appear godlike to lesser mortals.
> > > >
> > > > It seems quite apparent to me that these figures crop up in the mythologies/ histories of pretty much all the worlds cultures in some form or another and even share a lot of the same token attributes, being tall and shining, bird shamans, cult of the dead, possessing occult abilities etc, etc.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway. These are just my thoughts really...
> > > >
> > > > KaosCrow
> > > > xxx
> > > >
> > > > --- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto: sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>, "Cobweb" <cobweb.kt@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In sumerland@yahoogrou ps.com<http://us.mc301. mail.yahoo. com/mc/compose? to=sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto:sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com><mailto: sumerland% 40yahoogroups. com>, "kaoscrow@" <kaoscrow@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks for the recomendation, I've never come across that one. I'll have to have a butchers.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I think that we shouldn't neglect our own native northern European Watcher myths too. The Tuatha de Danaan, being prime candidates.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oooooh can of worms time.
> > > > > We did have a Tuatha de Danaan thread a while ago and it was ...."controversial" . It would be nice to go back to that. I'm as partial to the celts as I am to middle eastern myth.
> > > > > The Shining Ones by Christian and Barbara Joy O'Brien (apart from being very pricey and a tad bonkers in places) covers non-middle eastern nephilim traditions. From what I remember there was a lot on Nordic mythology.I' m begining to think that much of the nephilim mythos owes at least something to prehistoric European cultures and we exported and then re-inported it over many thousands of years.
> > > > > Webby
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>