Search the web
Sign In
New User? Sign Up
tuning · Welcome to the Alternate Tunings Mailing List.
? Already a member? Sign in to Yahoo!

Yahoo! Groups Tips

Did you know...
Show off your group to the world. Share a photo of your group with us.

Best of Y! Groups

   Check them out and nominate your group.
Having problems with message search? Fill out this form to ensure your group is one of the first to be migrated to the new message search system.

Messages

  Messages Help
Advanced
Johnny's assertions about W-III, on harpsichord   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #77854 of 85346 |
3:1 and 2:1 of the overtone-series more fundamental than 3/2 := (3:1)/(2:1)

--- In tuning@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Poletti" <paul@...> wrote:

Hi Paul,
> Start using just ONE clear and easy to understand method for
> indicating temperaments.
Simply consider all given values there
as frequencies in Hz of absolute pitches,
that are subjects of 3 possible sequential operations:

Algorithm for synchroneous well-temperaments:
1. Step 19-times an octaves down, by halfing the pitch-frequency
2. Go 12 times to partial 3:1, by multipying with facor 3.
occasional
3. Decrement frequncy by -1Hz down, when intend tempering flattend.

but only if you insist in "wide-5ths" then allow also too:
(4. Increment by +1Hz upwards, for an sharper "French"-5th.)

Comeback condition:
Choose the chain of flow in the operation sequence
so that the circle of a dozen 5ths returns back to the initial
start after 12times 3:1 and 19times 1:2 while fitting the
decrements so, that they yield an distribution of the PC=3^12:2^19
into
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superparticular_ratio
s.



> All that scala mismash and wierd stuff like
> multiplying frequencies by 3 instead of 1,5 just makes it all not
> worth the time.

That ratio of 3/2 = 1.5 arises operationally from taking the
quotient of the 3rd partial (3:1) over an octve (2:1),
when realting that both overtones #2 and #3 to theirs fundamental
(1:1) base.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_series_(music)
"...allowed wavelengths are 1/2, 1/3, 1/4, 1/5, 1/6, etc. times of the
fundamental."

but on strings there never appear 2/3 = 1:(3/2) due to the lack of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subharmonics
in pianos:
http://www.sfu.ca/sonic-studio/handbook/Subharmonic.html
"Subharmonics do not normally occur in natural sounds, although the
subharmonic f/2 may be generated by the cone of a LOUDSPEAKER."

That makes an 5th (3:2 = 1.5) less fundamental than the ratio
inbetween the overtones 3:1 and 2:1 within the harmonic series.

Hence an 5th is composed by an
division of an 12th (3:1) as nominator
over an octave (2:1) as denominator by the calculation

(3:2) := (3:1):(2:1)

In other words:
any 5th (3:2) consists terms of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic
as composed of the difference of an '12th'-'8th'.
"3 just perfect fifth P8 + P5 1902.0 702.0"
when both do refer to the same (1:1) base or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_frequency

hope that helps,
why i do prefer the multiplication by the "harmoic" factor 3
in order to stay wihin the partial-series.


Even Brad understood that in his:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bpl/larips/bachtemps.html
"...in the line of fifths A-E-B-F#-C#-G#-D#-Bb-F-C-G-D-A to reduce the
next note by 1 Hz, i.e. introducing a beat rate of 1 per second
against the preceding fifth. The fifths F#-C#-G#-D# and D-A are kept
pure. The other eight are adjusted by different geometric amounts,
based on the superparticular ratios described in his algorithm.
(Arithmetically, it amounts to subtracting 1 Hz from the top of most
of the columns, in his chart, wherever there are values in
parentheses.)"...

Brad contiues or the experts:
"Sparschuh's mathematical algorithm resembles the classic unproven
"Collatz Conjecture" from 1937, except that Sparschuh's iterated
function uses (3n-1) rather than (3n+1). [And see Eric Roosendaal's
3x+1 web site, along with this page by Frits Beukers demonstrating and
comparing the numerical sequences....]"


Yours Sincerely
A.S.

Yours Sincerely
A.S.




Fri Jun 27, 2008 7:56 pm

a_sparschuh
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email

Forward
Message #77854 of 85346 |
Expand Messages Author Sort by Date

... All righty...this exercise is principally for Johnny, but also for Andreas and anyone else who wants to listen along. For one who allegedly "sings" W-III...
Brad Lehman
bplehman27
Offline Send Email
Jun 23, 2008
2:31 pm

If you can remember, I did a similar listening test a while back http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/tuning/message/69224 I think I took the files down, but I...
Aaron Krister Johnson
akjmicro
Offline Send Email
Jun 23, 2008
2:40 pm

... knocked ... several ... your ... Hi Brad & all others lovers of his wide"French"-5ths hypothesis, Johnny also disagrees with Brad's hypothesis in: ...
Andreas Sparschuh
a_sparschuh
Offline Send Email
Jun 26, 2008
7:54 pm

... I don't know abot others, here, Andreas, but I am not even gonna try to unravel what you might trying to say until you stop doing several rediculous...
Paul Poletti
losekanon
Offline Send Email
Jun 26, 2008
8:42 pm

... Hi Paul, ... Simply consider all given values there as frequencies in Hz of absolute pitches, that are subjects of 3 possible sequential operations: ...
Andreas Sparschuh
a_sparschuh
Offline Send Email
Jun 27, 2008
7:56 pm
Advanced

Copyright © 2009 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy - Terms of Service - Guidelines - Help